Conflict of interest with banks

juliareyes

Active Member
If a bank debit card is being used by someone else other than the issuee and the issuee has given consent to someone else to use it all the time, what problems might the other party encounter? The issuee/trustee is registered at an address in lets say fiji but the person using it lives in north america, (united states, canada) and theyre the only ones using it all the time, what conflict of interest might the card user and not the issuee/trustee encounter with the issuing bank? What could be the potential conflict of interest here with the issuing bank/s? Would anyone care to elaborate as what could be the potential conflict of interest for all parties involved? I am all ears you guys here.......
 

xzars

Trusted Member
Business Angel
It's basically a form of smurfing. Not allowed under Mastercard, Visa T&C.

One of the day to day issues is that if you make payments in the Americas, some store clerks ask for an ID when customers pay with foreign cards. From the practicality standpoint, you will not be able to use that card ~10% of the time because you do not have an ID matching the card. And if you do, does the person look like you? To overcome that, it's best if that Fiji smurf opens an account in one of the well-known banks in Canada or US, or wherever the ultimate end-user lives.

Chargebacks are the primary conflict of interest for the smurf, exposing the ultimate end-user. A rogue smurf may get in touch with the issuing bank and claim that you're doing card fraud, requesting payment reversals. It's usually possible for 60 days after the payment.

Let's say you want to spend $10,000 of your dirty money over 2 months and pay the smurf $500. The smurf can file a claim of card fraud, and possibly leave with $10,500.

How do you overcome that? Make the smurf unaware of the bank, but request enough input in a coordinated way to get the account opened on his behalf. Easier said than done, but still possible. I'm not going into detail.
 
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juliareyes

Active Member
It's basically a form of smurfing. Not allowed under Mastercard, Visa T&C.

One of the day to day issues is that if you make payments in the Americas, some store clerks ask for an ID when customers pay with foreign cards. From the practicality standpoint, you will not be able to use that card ~10% of the time because you do not have an ID matching the card. And if you do, does the person look like you? To overcome that, it's best if that Fiji smurf opens an account in one of the well-known banks in Canada or US, or wherever the ultimate end-user lives.

Chargebacks are the primary conflict of interest for the smurf, exposing the ultimate end-user. A rogue smurf may get in touch with the issuing bank and claim that you're doing card fraud, requesting payment reversals. It's usually possible for 60 days after the payment.

Let's say you want to spend $10,000 of your dirty money over 2 months and pay the smurf $500. The smurf can file a claim of card fraud, and possibly leave with $10,500.

How do you overcome that? Make the smurf unaware of the bank, but request enough input in a coordinated way to get the account opened on his behalf. Easier said than done, but still possible. I'm not going into detail.
It sounds to me like you are suggesting money laundering here. What do you mean not allowed under Visa or Mastercard? What is T and C? Well, if you say that it is not allowed under visa or mastercard, why are you saying that it is still possible then? I am confused here.... You are contradicting yourself here. Well, what about American Express and Discover debit cards from any offshore bank? What about these other two? If not you, would there be anyone else kind enough to explain these legal terms? I am not trying to do anything illegal but instead am wondering if by doing this it would violate any regulations imposed by visa, mastercard, american express, or discover? Can anyone else help me here? Someone? Kindly reply back. Thank you.
 

xzars

Trusted Member
Business Angel
@juliareyes

It's not just about MC and Visa, those were a few examples.

If what you're trying to accomplish were legal, then any efforts to enforce personal income tax and AML laws would be futile. Just like extinguishing forest fires by giving half the crew gasoline instead of water.

Maybe you can legally nominate your kid or other family member to use your card - in some countries, in certain amounts. That's about it; can't do it with unrelated parties. With "can't do it", I mean can't do it legally.
 

juliareyes

Active Member
@juliareyes

It's not just about MC and Visa, those were a few examples.

If what you're trying to accomplish were legal, then any efforts to enforce personal income tax and AML laws would be futile. Just like extinguishing forest fires by giving half the crew gasoline instead of water.

Maybe you can legally nominate your kid or other family member to use your card - in some countries, in certain amounts. That's about it; can't do it with unrelated parties. With "can't do it", I mean can't do it legally.
So only relatives only then???? Like my sister or something????? Rsvp
 
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