WireCard - hope this isnt another SATA

[neweraoffshore]

It's unbelievable that such a big and trusted German company had such activity

hmmm, actually Germany is not that innocent as everybody thinks. There is a reason why the Family Offices of the Arab, Russian, Thai etc. Elite are located in Munich. Just a side note for a book in can recommend, if any German is reading this, as this book sadly only exists in German and is called "Steueroase Deutschland" which translates to "Tax Haven Germany" . It's quite easy to do physical cash transactions and hide owner of real estates. That's why the big guys like Jürgen Mossack and like 80% of the Miami offshore scene are Germans. Cum-Ex, VAT Carousels etc. are all "made in Germany" haha. Germany #1 in engineering and offshore . Just want to remind everybody that Germany is ranked #7 in the FSI, before UAE, BVI, UK and other more famous jurisdictions. Source: Financial Secrecy Index - Wikipedia . Germany is just s**t for companies following the "rules" and only do business within Germany. Especially the German working class are the most fucked. But they are too stupid to realize what is going on and kept small by crazy high taxes. In my opinion, it's absolutely ridiculous that everybody trust so much in Germany...
Again, Wirecard was ALL THE TIME FAMOUS FOR PROCESSING SHADY BUSINESSES.
Book: Steueroase Deutschland: Warum bei uns viele Reiche keine Steuern zahlen: Amazon.de: Meinzer, Markus: Bücher

It was a little offtopic and not directly Wirecard related, but I think this was a helpful post to understand a little why and how stuff like Wirecard can happen in "trusted" Germany. I could write a lot more about crooked Germany, but this would get too much offtopic.
After a scandal like this it is highly likely that the ropes will again be more tightened.... . So brace yourself for future law changes.... .

 

[randomname11]

Got this from Bitsafe last night (same as the others):

Dear customer, At Bitsafe we do our best to get you the best customer experience possible. You have been using the Bitsafe Debit Card actively. Because of reasons beyond our control we are required to temporarily cease the use of your Bitsafe Debit Card. This is the reason: In order to get access to the VISA and MasterCard card networks, Bitsafe has partnered with different organizations around the world. Your card in particular has been provided according to a contract between Bitsafe, MasterCard and Wirecard Card Solutions, a Bitsafe business partner in the United Kingdom. This company in the United Kingdom is independent from Wirecard AG, its mother company in Germany. Wirecard AG has filed for insolvency yesterday. The English Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) as well as MasterCard wants to ensure that such independence is guaranteed. For that reason Mastercard asked us to temporarily stop all transactions on all cards that relate to Wirecard Card Solutions, including the card issued to you. If all transactions are stopped the FCA and MasterCard can complete their research without new transactions coming in. We hope to enable your Bitsafe Debit Card again in the next couple of days, after the research by the FCA and MasterCard has been completed. Regarding your funds: your funds are not held by Wirecard Card Solutions nor by Wirecard AG. The relationship between Bitsafe and Wirecard Card Solutions is purely contractual. All your funds are safely stored at the European Central Bank. If the Wirecard situation is not resolved in a timely manner we will issue you a new card under a different contractual arrangement with another card issuer. We apologize for the inconvenience in this matter, but we have no other choice than strictly follow the rules and guidelines set by FCA and MasterCard, and allowing to complete their research. With kind regards, Bitsafe Support

 

[Edge]

Well I got caught on this one .. Wasn't even aware of wirecard troubles in the beginning of the week, I was disconnected completely from news etc ...

I use payoneer alot, I'm in big trouble now, not because of the money, I'd kiss that money goodbye, but who else besides wirecard issues cards worldwide ? I mean outside europe / us ? We had trouble with cards for couple years now, nobody offers cards worldwide, and only payoneer and couple others did it because of wirecard ...

My point is that, this won't have a happy ending for people in my situation ... Like if name.com asks me to renew a domain for 10 bux I have no way to pay that right now.

 

[Spinat]

People with the WireCard debit card are pretty much in trouble and won't get it work for a long time. As posted in some of the osts already, you better get yourself a backup card or something.

 

[Edge]

People with the WireCard debit card are pretty much in trouble and won't get it work for a long time. As posted in some of the osts already, you better get yourself a backup card or something.

For a long time ? I think it's gone forever ...

There is no other alternative .. everybody was using wirecard, at least for people outside the sepa region ...

And payoneer was my alternative already, I was on my last leg already lol

This is gonna be a fun weekend

 

[LastHero]

Very sad, in Wirecard financial hole on 1.9 billion$ Wirecard AG

EY failed to check Wirecard bank statements for 3 years
Auditor of insolvent payments group under fire for failing to detect fraud

EY had issued unqualified audits of Wirecard for a decade despite questions over suspect accounting practices from journalists and short-sellers © FT montage
Below article Financial Times

June 26, 2020 12:50 pm
EY failed for more than three years to request crucial account information from a Singapore bank where Wirecard claimed it had up to €1bn in cash — a routine audit procedure that could have uncovered the vast fraud at the German payments group.

The accountancy firm, which audited Wirecard for a decade, has come under fire after the once high-flying fintech company filed for insolvency this week, revealing that €1.9bn in cash probably did “not exist”.

People with first-hand knowledge told the Financial Times that the auditor between 2016 and 2018 did not check directly with Singapore’s OCBC Bank to confirm that the lender held large amounts of cash on behalf of Wirecard. Instead, EY relied on documents and screenshots provided by a third-party trustee and Wirecard itself.


“The big question for me is what on earth did EY do when they signed off the accounts?” said a senior banker at a lender with credit exposure to Wirecard.

A senior auditor at another firm said that obtaining independent confirmation of bank balances was “equivalent to day-one training at audit school”.

OCBC declined to comment. A person briefed on the details told the Financial Times that Wirecard has no banking relationship with OCBC and that the fintech’s former Singapore-based trustee does not have an escrow account with the bank. The lender did not receive any query from EY in relation to Wirecard between 2016 and 2018, the person added

Markus Braun, Wirecard chief goes from billionaire to bail
The Big Four accounting firm had issued unqualified audits of Wire-card for a decade despite increasing questions over suspect accounting practices from journalists and short sellers.

An “out of country” team at EY is reviewing the work carried out by its German auditors, according to a person close to the firm.

The German accounting watchdog FREP is probing Wirecard’s balance sheet, and the country’s auditor oversight body APAS has begun looking into EY’s work. EY declined to comment on the regulatory investigation and details of its work. FREP and APAS declined to comment.

The accounts at Asian banks play a pivotal role in Wirecard’s accounting fraud that culminated in the group filing for insolvency on Thursday.

According to the company’s former management, the accounts were used to settle transactions with partners who acted on Wirecard’s behalf in countries where it did not have its own licences to process electronic payments. Yet it is now unclear if the accounts — let alone the money allegedly deposited there — ever existed.

Wirecard had told its auditors that the money moved late last year from OCBC to banks in the Philippines, where supposedly there was now €1.9bn deposited.

A special audit by KPMG could not obtain original documents from the banks to prove deposits existed. EY was told this month by the banks that paperwork it had previously seen on the Philippine accounts was “spurious” and they did not exis
The head of audit at a rival accounting firm to EY said: “It is beyond the realms of reality that EY wouldn’t have had [the bank balance confirmations] unless they did a very poor audit. Cash is easy to audit. If investors can’t trust the cash number, what can they trust?”

In a statement issued on Thursday, EY said there were “clear indications that this was an elaborate and sophisticated fraud, involving multiple parties around the world in different institutions, with a deliberate aim of deception”. The company argued that “even the most robust audit procedures may not uncover this kind of fraud”.

Hansrudi Lenz, professor of accounting at Würzburg university, told the Financial Times that it was “not sufficient” for an auditor to rely on account confirmations that were provided by third parties. “The auditor needs to have full control over the delivery of account confirmation,” he said, adding that this was stipulated by procedural guidelines.

Germany’s small shareholder lobby group SdK on Friday said it filed criminal complaints against the EY auditors who signed Wirecard’s accounts between 2016 and 2018, accusing them of violating professional duties.

Accounts published by Wirecard showed that five different EY partners signed its accounts over the past five years. Among them is Andreas Loetscher, who co-led EY’s audits into Wirecard between 2015 and 2017 and a year later joined Deutsche Bank as chief accounting officer.

Deutsche Bank said: “There are many open questions with regard to Wirecard. We highly appreciate our work with Andreas Loetscher. Moreover . . . the presumption of innocence of course applies to him as well.”

Wirecard insolvency, Brussels to probe German regulator, Federal Reserve bans buybacks
EY is already facing a class-action lawsuit in Germany brought by Wirecard investors. Wolfgang Schirp, a Berlin-based lawyer who is working on the case against the audit firm, said: “It is frightening how long Wirecard was able to operate without being objected to by the auditors. We have been monitoring Wirecard since 2008 and have collected very extensive material. It was always clear that something was wrong.”

Akshay Naheta, a SoftBank executive who led an investment in Wirecard last year, attacked EY on Twitter last week. “I’m totally baffled by the lack of competence and responsibility displayed by E&Y,” he wrote. “As an organisation that is meant to protect all stakeholders — creditors and shareholders — in companies, both public and private, they have materially failed in their fiduciary duties.”

For years EY has said it wants to expand its roster of clients on Germany’s DAX 30 index as it audits fewer companies than its rivals KPMG and PwC. EY earned nearly €10m for its audits of Wirecard over the past decade.

The Wirecard fraud is one of several international accounting scandals that have emerged on EY’s watch this year, including at NMC Health and Luckin Coffee

 

[Tax Cow]

Wirecard AG is a stunningly beautiful showcase of why the AML laws & customer harassment - at least the one based on requests for easy-to-fabricate documents where the subject provides the document - is utterly pointless.

Those with the time and a motive will cut through that crap, like a hot knife through communists' soggy butter.

 

[ffbkdavid]

@anotherone . Deposits are secured by the German "Einlagesicherungsfonds" . As already said, the only problem will be the Visa/Mastercards/JCB licenses as this may result in non working cards. Everything is working as usual and no Wirecard client is experiencing any problems by now. The only people I would suggest to withdrawal are the one with really big amounts like 750k+ € as everything above is not insured. In case of a bankruptcy the German government guarantees a pay out in 2 weeks.

Braun is already free again (on bail), which was obvious. Same day.

However in my opinion a bankruptcy is inevitable.
Aldi, Revolut, KLM, Orange, Orange Bank, Grab and a lot of big companies already announced to switch to different payment processors.
It's even unlikely that some investor will buy Wirecard after the trust is damaged so much and Wirecard is everywhere in the news in Europe. Also it will be quite easy for businesses to change the payment processor. They just need to change API credentials, haha. So Wirecard will loose a lot more of clients which makes it even more uninteresting for investors.

For the guys worried about EPB. Intercash cards are indeed issued by Wirecard. However they removed all links to Wirecard online. One of their card programs was even called "WireCard"

free on bail: well... 5,000,000 deposit in cash not to be underestimated... might the judge think... probably

i assume there "software" and tecnical assets could be taken over by a competitor... or any body offering some cash as their system was/is "state of the art"

and... i don't think that "providers" of the quality of revolut and/or orange bank (former "baltikums bank") are competent to judge any wrongdoint of wirecard

 

[user 01]

I got at payoneer few thousands - almost all I have is there. got some funds day before.
doing online business for 15 years I had 2 bank accounts - both are closed banks now. and as a last resort I have payoneer. so, no money for diapers since yesterday. left on petrol station without money to pay gas.

maybe someone knows how this things are going with payoneer and can explain? payoneer is uk company and doing business with wirecard uk subsidiary. funds are frozen, as they said, to secure deposits of card holders. does that situation can help in any way for payoneer customers? thanks

 

[shilloah]

I got at payoneer few thousands - almost all I have is there. got some funds day before.
doing online business for 15 years I had 2 bank accounts - both are closed banks now. and as a last resort I have payoneer. so, no money for diapers since yesterday. left on petrol station without money to pay gas.

maybe someone knows how this things are going with payoneer and can explain? payoneer is uk company and doing business with wirecard uk subsidiary. funds are frozen, as they said, to secure deposits of card holders. does that situation can help in any way for payoneer customers? thanks

same situation over here, knew nothing about all of this when It all started

 

[reesek]

Well I got caught on this one .. Wasn't even aware of wirecard troubles in the beginning of the week, I was disconnected completely from news etc ...

I use payoneer alot, I'm in big trouble now, not because of the money, I'd kiss that money goodbye, but who else besides wirecard issues cards worldwide ? I mean outside europe / us ? We had trouble with cards for couple years now, nobody offers cards worldwide, and only payoneer and couple others did it because of wirecard ...

My point is that, this won't have a happy ending for people in my situation ... Like if name.com asks me to renew a domain for 10 bux I have no way to pay that right now.

We have a solution to issue worldwide. It's in beta now. Can test with you for free if you want to try

 

[rey skywalker]

this is a completly disater , bafin should come in and take over and cover all clints , if they do not is clear is not possible to europe financial system and regulators

 

[Edge]

I got at payoneer few thousands - almost all I have is there. got some funds day before.
doing online business for 15 years I had 2 bank accounts - both are closed banks now. and as a last resort I have payoneer. so, no money for diapers since yesterday. left on petrol station without money to pay gas.

maybe someone knows how this things are going with payoneer and can explain? payoneer is uk company and doing business with wirecard uk subsidiary. funds are frozen, as they said, to secure deposits of card holders. does that situation can help in any way for payoneer customers? thanks

I completely understand .. Every year there are less and less solutions for people outside the sepa region and the US ..

Anyway, Best case scenario, from what Payoneer staff said, the FCA completes its investigation into Wirecard UK (which is a separate company that issues cards for oh so many card providers, the biggest being payoneer with 4 million customers), best case scenario next week. They find nothing wrong with the company, cards are unfrozen and you are able to withdraw, and of course payoneer will be working on finding another card issuer (my question is who else issues cards for people outside the sepa region ??) ...

That's the hope for now .. and as you can see, many IFs in that scenario ..

 

[RSGM]

For a long time ? I think it's gone forever ...

There is no other alternative .. everybody was using wirecard, at least for people outside the sepa region ...

And payoneer was my alternative already, I was on my last leg already lol

This is gonna be a fun weekend

Use virtual prepaid cards?

 

[Edge]

Use virtual prepaid cards?

Give me examples ..
Someone recommended "cosmo payment" I'm looking into it now ..
Any other alternatives ?

Thanks

 

[RSGM]

Give me examples ..
Someone recommended "cosmo payment" I'm looking into it now ..
Any other alternatives ?

Thanks

Use Neteller or Skrill. They even ship out physical cards to most countries.
I don't know why everyone is so hung on Payoneer and never mentioned Neteller or Skrill. Payoneer their limits on their cards are laughable.
Payoneer you cannot even use for private use, with Skrill and Neteller you have both options (private and business).
Payoneer you have physical cards, with Skrill and Neteller you have both options (physical and virtual)
Payoneer you have one deposit option, with Skrill and Neteller (depending on your country) you have like 10.

 

[Martin Everson]

Well today I got this email from Payoneer. But thanks to this forum I withdrew 80% of my funds there on Monday "just in case" haha.

Glad to hear you heeded the advice and removed money . I removed everything most EMI's June 19th when this thread appeared. When you hear scandal run for your life immediately and don't wait to assess risk .

 

[Edge]

Use Neteller or Skrill. They even ship out physical cards to most countries.
I don't know why everyone is so hung on Payoneer and never mentioned Neteller or Skrill. Payoneer their limits on their cards are laughable.
Payoneer you cannot even use for private use, with Skrill and Neteller you have both options (private and business).
Payoneer you have physical cards, with Skrill and Neteller you have both options (physical and virtual)
Payoneer you have one deposit option, with Skrill and Neteller (depending on your country) you have like 10.

Thanks man, but most of the thing you said are wrong )
Skrill is like the heaven of scam artists ... But thanks anyway

 

[Tax Cow]

Skrill was almost an essential component in casino-related washing back in the day. Good memories

Turned sour many many years ago with EU regulatory tightening which gifted all laundergamblers to non-EU competitors. Some EU nations took a considerable hit in tax revenue over night. But how does Skrill still survive? They must have some serious business sense and ability to adapt.

Btw. for prepaid business cards outside EUEA and the US, you still have Transferwise and Paysera. Lots of countries covered.

 

[Edge]

Skrill was almost an essential component in casino-related washing back in the day. Good memories

Turned sour many many years ago with EU regulatory tightening which gifted all laundergamblers to non-EU competitors. Some EU nations took a considerable hit in tax revenue over night. But how does Skrill still survive? They must have some serious business sense and ability to adapt.

Btw. for prepaid business cards outside EUEA and the US, you still have Transferwise and Paysera. Lots of countries covered.

So much shady stuff with Skrill .. I stayed away from it a while back, when I visited a forum where people were selling all kinds crap, and most of the ones that look like scams were using Skrill or Bitcoin to get paid .. That should tell you something ...

I have a business account with Transferwise, they issued a card for my company (incorporated in europe) but they can't issue a card for my associated personal account. They only issue cards for Sepa region / US too .. Basically like everybody else ...

Same goes for Paysera ... They only issue cards for EU / EEA residents ..