Can you find justice in a courtroom?

[JohnnyDoe]

Today is Good Friday, the day we remember how the legal system once did its job by executing a nice guy.

It’s a reminder that law doesn’t equal to justice.

Truth in a courtroom is just background noise, tolerated only if it doesn’t get in the way of the mafia state.
The judiciary is the weapon used by the state for its own purposes.

Unless your father can revert a sentence in 3 days, don’t count on the system to save you.

 

[daniels27]

It’s a reminder that law doesn’t equal to justice.

The first person who told me this was my tax auditor if the administration in my home village. Wise words I remembered.

 

[cherry]

Not in my experience.

 

[marioIT]

So true, i missed this thread.
I have experience in EU courtrooms and also have seen and heard from friends.

I've been almost scammed by multiple lawyers too. Ultimately they're sharks... if you find a good one do not even think of trying another one...

I've seen judges not giving a f* about reading the papers attached and just spewing random sentences, and then you'll have to pay your lawyer to have them fixed when it's possible, or must appeal and it'll take many years of lawyers fees... just to have a piece of paper of a (supposedly smarter) second judge telling the first one that he was dumb as f* (cause when you win the appeal that's what's literally written in the sentence...)

once you get to that point, you start questioning many things... how is it possible that two judges say two opposite things on the same matter, and the second one pretty much told the first one he was dumb as a brick?
so there are many judges that don't even know what they are talking about, and yet they can ruin the life of people like that?

ultimately I always won, sometimes in full, sometimes sadly partially and lost money (and everyone knew I was 100% right).
Other times the judge will not accept your proofs as enough. Things must be proved on paper on a certain way. You do, but then there are procedural issues and it's impossible to prove facts that way after many years, they would want a 30yo piece of paper signed by a dead man from past and they don't care if you take there the whole country to testify for you.

Also I've seen courts literally lose important papers ending the whole ruling, or turning it completely against you...

But seriously I think it was not worth living like that for decades, defending yourself for what everyone knew it was true, and just seeing lawyers and judges ignore reality and go fighting over a comma of a 100 years old law, and writing pages and pages around that comma... depending on which side you look at it, and that comma is what's going to effect the final rule.
Nobody will care about your story ultimately, and they will fight for that comma. They really lose the contact with reality.
I've read 100's pages of sentences and it is clear that at a point not even the judge knew what to do and called it a day...

my lawyer told me: never believe the truth that will get out of courtroom is the real one...
you know you are innocent, you enter the courtroom door as innocent/victim. But once there that doesn't matter anymore. Anything could happen. A small formal mistake and you're putting your whole life/family/money on the plate.
I took it as a joke as I was naive. I thought he wanted to scare me just to have more money...
I was still "virgin" and blindly trusted the "system".
I paid taxes being sure that the police would come in seconds to my house if i needed it, they would die to save my family if I had a need. Tried this, didn't work that way.
I thought doctors would save my life for free and not doing it for the money. Tried this, didn't work that way.
I thought the public employees were working for me... and corruption was nonexistent. Tried this, didn't work that way.
I thought every policeman was honest, that public servants were hard workers as much as the private sector ones... Tried this, didn't work that way.

then you really start experiencing it...
Boy, was I wrong!

always remember the only person you can rely on is yourself, so technically we are all alone...

 

[bubbledouble]

Unless your father can revert a sentence in 3 days, don’t count on the system to save you.

most often you're right, but what was the advise you told the other members, you knew the game, get over it, not worth to do anything, even the thread is not worth it!

 

[JohnnyDoe]

most often you're right, but what was the advise you told the other members, you knew the game, get over it, not worth to do anything, even the thread is not worth it!

Their game, their rules, you can’t win. But you can play your own game with your own rules.

 

[wellington]

Been involved in

3 Criminal Cases (Thailand)
3 Civil Cases (Australia, UK, Canada)

- Criminal cases were pretty fair to be honest as they were done based on Black or White, 3 judge panel and prosecution team (non Jury)
- UK and Canada Civil cases costs more than the actual end result, the Australian case cost 500,000$ (AUD) for a return of 50,000$ (AUD)

So even if you win you loose.

 

[daniels27]

- UK and Canada Civil cases costs more than the actual end result, the Australian case cost 500,000$ (AUD) for a return of 50,000$ (AUD)

I always wonder who starts such bs and with what motivation. But maybe, they did not care about the money buy their honour.

 

[Macy]

I only ever experienced a single lawsuit, which was with the tax agency in one country and I won it, although mainly due to their administrative failures.

So I would agree with previous posters and say that in general, no. I am not so focused on ideological factors but would consider myself close to an anarcho-capitalist stance in most areas, like here that the best way of resolving is direct or via private arbitration

 

[EliasIT]

I only ever experienced a single lawsuit, which was with the tax agency in one country and I won it, although mainly due to their administrative failures.

Then I hope I’ll be just as lucky as you in my case, where the tax authority has done nothing but fabricate claims without any legal basis, and none of them are true.

 

[cherry]

So true, i missed this thread.
I have experience in EU courtrooms and also have seen and heard from friends.

I've been almost scammed by multiple lawyers too. Ultimately they're sharks... if you find a good one do not even think of trying another one...

I've seen judges not giving a f* about reading the papers attached and just spewing random sentences, and then you'll have to pay your lawyer to have them fixed when it's possible, or must appeal and it'll take many years of lawyers fees... just to have a piece of paper of a (supposedly smarter) second judge telling the first one that he was dumb as f* (cause when you win the appeal that's what's literally written in the sentence...)

once you get to that point, you start questioning many things... how is it possible that two judges say two opposite things on the same matter, and the second one pretty much told the first one he was dumb as a brick?
so there are many judges that don't even know what they are talking about, and yet they can ruin the life of people like that?

ultimately I always won, sometimes in full, sometimes sadly partially and lost money (and everyone knew I was 100% right).
Other times the judge will not accept your proofs as enough. Things must be proved on paper on a certain way. You do, but then there are procedural issues and it's impossible to prove facts that way after many years, they would want a 30yo piece of paper signed by a dead man from past and they don't care if you take there the whole country to testify for you.

Also I've seen courts literally lose important papers ending the whole ruling, or turning it completely against you...

But seriously I think it was not worth living like that for decades, defending yourself for what everyone knew it was true, and just seeing lawyers and judges ignore reality and go fighting over a comma of a 100 years old law, and writing pages and pages around that comma... depending on which side you look at it, and that comma is what's going to effect the final rule.
Nobody will care about your story ultimately, and they will fight for that comma. They really lose the contact with reality.
I've read 100's pages of sentences and it is clear that at a point not even the judge knew what to do and called it a day...

my lawyer told me: never believe the truth that will get out of courtroom is the real one...
you know you are innocent, you enter the courtroom door as innocent/victim. But once there that doesn't matter anymore. Anything could happen. A small formal mistake and you're putting your whole life/family/money on the plate.
I took it as a joke as I was naive. I thought he wanted to scare me just to have more money...
I was still "virgin" and blindly trusted the "system".
I paid taxes being sure that the police would come in seconds to my house if i needed it, they would die to save my family if I had a need. Tried this, didn't work that way.
I thought doctors would save my life for free and not doing it for the money. Tried this, didn't work that way.
I thought the public employees were working for me... and corruption was nonexistent. Tried this, didn't work that way.
I thought every policeman was honest, that public servants were hard workers as much as the private sector ones... Tried this, didn't work that way.

then you really start experiencing it...
Boy, was I wrong!

always remember the only person you can rely on is yourself, so technically we are all alone...

These are pretty much my experiences. I was naive. Whenever I try to explain to normies that the courts are corrupt, they get angry at me for even saying so, and don't accept my experiences as legit or that I'm being truthful about it.

Likewise if you've ever spoken to a lawyer, cop or judge online about the judicial system, it's like talking to a robot. They just cannot/will not compute that the judiciary is wrong or illegitimate. But during the court process, they manipulate language and evidence like they have zero morals at all. Like a devil who believes he isn't evil.

My desire to not pay any taxes stems from the fact that I don't want to pay the courts to carry on their corrupt activities, nor do I want to pay the wages of the judges, or pay for the crests above the door. None of it.

 

[marioIT]

I could write a thing or two about judges but would be so specific that would 100% put me in troubles.
The joke is that you could kill a man and get by... but if you tell a judge to f**k off in front of other people, you're getting arrested right there on the spot, in many of the so called first world countries

but you know the old adage "Who watches the watchmen"... they've got almost absolute power.
Even if you're a police officer... if a judge decides you're a danger for some reason (maybe knowing too much?), he just tells his assistant to call your supervisor and your career ends there and get moved elsewhere. Any decent policeman knows that he must stay far away from judges and causing issues to them, or simply making them work too much...

(some of them are are truly retarded nuts, borderline n**i even off work hours, they're almost all very politicized, some are members of "secret" societies, they've got plenty of dark addictions and many of them are psychologically unstable BTW yet they can "judge" your life...)

heck a few months ago I went to testify for a friend.
The judge had no assistant as it was meant to be really a 5 minutes thing. So he had just to type a few lines on a computer as the recording system wasn't working...
He was so pissed to work that day, it was totally embarrassing.
My friend's lawyer had to tell me to stay calm multiple times...
he had just one thing to do: to read the question loudly and write down my answer.
He just didn't want to write what I was saying, the way I was saying it.
He was altering my words in the way he liked them more... to create his own reality!
It seemed as if my testimony was altering the image of the whole process he already had in his head, and my words would've meant more work for him.
It was crazy really. Had to to argue loudly 5 more minutes to write down the words the way I said them.
He then started screaming and shouting at me... telling me to behave multiple times.
I said nothing bad, I just told him to please type the exact words as I said. He insisted, I insisted and it went on like that for a while.
He lost more time trying to "educate" me then typing two phrases really.
I am pretty sure 5 minutes more of that BS and I would've been handcuffed, but I can say you it would've been well worth...

("Equal justice under law" and such phrases in courts anywhere in the world are totally BS, if you don't already know... for the newbies here!)

 

[Steve3000]

These are pretty much my experiences. I was naive. Whenever I try to explain to normies that the courts are corrupt, they get angry at me for even saying so, and don't accept my experiences as legit or that I'm being truthful about it.

Likewise if you've ever spoken to a lawyer, cop or judge online about the judicial system, it's like talking to a robot. They just cannot/will not compute that the judiciary is wrong or illegitimate. But during the court process, they manipulate language and evidence like they have zero morals at all. Like a devil who believes he isn't evil.

My desire to not pay any taxes stems from the fact that I don't want to pay the courts to carry on their corrupt activities, nor do I want to pay the wages of the judges, or pay for the crests above the door. None of it.

I work in Italy and one thing I have learned is to stay well clear of any problems that require lawyers. The only time we used a lawyer rather than a Notario (solicitor) was to certify some photocopies in English. Contact me if you ever need a very friendly English-speaking lawyer in Milano.

But two colleagues have had terrible times with lawyers, both being ripped off and not obtaining justice, One case due to a very powerful family and police not wanting to get involved. The other case due to a totally incompetent lawyer.

So I stay under the radar as much as possible and avoid being too involved in Italian business.

 

[mytoofood]

That depends on whether the courtroom is a public one, or mine, where I serve as both judge and executioner, handing down sentences to those who believe they're above other people.