Best Brokerage for NON-US and NON-EU resident

[moneyhoney]

Hi all,

I know there is already something about this in the forum but after reading I couldn't have a clear idea. What's the best choice to invest in ETF, index funds, etc. for a NON-US and NON-EU resident?

I was going with Interactive Brokers but another opinion is always welcome. I just read about Internaxx which I didn't know: opinions?


Thanks.

 

[Martin Everson]

Are low fees a concern? If not then Saxobank or BGL BNP Paribas Luxembourg offering which requires minimum 50k. Others I use are not in English or just way too expensive.

 

[Joe Blasco]

Hi all,

I know there is already something about this in the forum but after reading I couldn't have a clear idea. What's the best choice to invest in ETF, index funds, etc. for a NON-US and NON-EU resident?

I was going with Interactive Brokers but another opinion is always welcome. I just read about Internaxx which I didn't know: opinions?


Thanks.

interactive brokers only saliva specimen and thumbprints do not require to accept as a client, totally pricks...

 

[BlueMist]

After doing quite extensive research on this myself very recently, I went with Internaxx, which was bought by SwissQuote last year. SQ is also a good option. Alternatively Standard Chartered Singapore has pretty extensive ETF choices. Internaxx/SQ have both fixed custody fees, while SC SG has no custody fees at all, making it very attractive option. There is however 0.2% trading commission for priority banking (0.25% otherwise).

You can read a lot about Internaxx on Andrew Hallam's website, he also get some special deals for new customers, e.g. free trades or lowered fees for few months.

I did consider IBKR but decided against it:
- FDC $250,000 insurance seems to be valid on USD currency only
- complicated trading system (compared to Internaxx/SQ)
- estate tax risk for non US persons

The estate tax risk is complicated one and opinions vary, normally if you don't hold US stocks, US bonds, US domiciled ETFs, it should not apply but there are still a lot of questions and doubts about this. I am after Irish domiciled ETFs, but ultimately decided against IBKR.

There are however rich people who would trade via IBKR and transfer the positions out of IBKR. This transfers are free. So you can buy cheap and transfer them somewhere else for safekeeping, some brokers do charge a fee for receiving position transfer as well.

Banks have usually quite high custody fees (apart from the Standard Chartered Singapore mentioned above). Citibank UAE has 0.2% custody, Citibank IPB London has 0.5%. Julius Baer 0.3%, it can go down to 0.1% if you have like €5mln invested.

 

[rowena]

Are low fees a concern? If not then Saxobank or BGL BNP Paribas Luxembourg offering which requires minimum 50k. Others I use are not in English or just way too expensive.

I checked Paribas Luxembourg and it looks like they offer term deposits. I am also looking for another broker other than IB, SQ which offers terms deposits. Do you know any ? Thanks.

 

[moneyhoney]

Are low fees a concern? If not then Saxobank or BGL BNP Paribas Luxembourg offering which requires minimum 50k. Others I use are not in English or just way too expensive.

What's your opinion about Internaxx?

After doing quite extensive research on this myself very recently, I went with Internaxx, which was bought by SwissQuote last year. SQ is also a good option. Alternatively Standard Chartered Singapore has pretty extensive ETF choices. Internaxx/SQ have both fixed custody fees, while SC SG has no custody fees at all, making it very attractive option. There is however 0.2% trading commission for priority banking (0.25% otherwise).

You can read a lot about Internaxx on Andrew Hallam's website, he also get some special deals for new customers, e.g. free trades or lowered fees for few months.

I did consider IBKR but decided against it:
- FDC $250,000 insurance seems to be valid on USD currency only
- complicated trading system (compared to Internaxx/SQ)
- estate tax risk for non US persons

The estate tax risk is complicated one and opinions vary, normally if you don't hold US stocks, US bonds, US domiciled ETFs, it should not apply but there are still a lot of questions and doubts about this. I am after Irish domiciled ETFs, but ultimately decided against IBKR.

There are however rich people who would trade via IBKR and transfer the positions out of IBKR. This transfers are free. So you can buy cheap and transfer them somewhere else for safekeeping, some brokers do charge a fee for receiving position transfer as well.

Banks have usually quite high custody fees (apart from the Standard Chartered Singapore mentioned above). Citibank UAE has 0.2% custody, Citibank IPB London has 0.5%. Julius Baer 0.3%, it can go down to 0.1% if you have like €5mln invested.

Thanks for taking the time to post this.

I had a look into Standard Chartered Singapore but not sure it's straightforward to open it. Is it?

 

[BlueMist]

I had a look into Standard Chartered Singapore but not sure it's straightforward to open it. Is it?

Hard to say these days but if you are willing to open priority account by depositing SGD 200,000 or equivalent in another currency, then it should be possible but personal visit is required. You can drop them an email and ask, perhaps it is possible to open account remotely by having the documents checked in one of of their international branches.

 

[moneyhoney]

Hard to say these days but if you are willing to open priority account by depositing SGD 200,000 or equivalent in another currency, then it should be possible but personal visit is required. You can drop them an email and ask, perhaps it is possible to open account remotely by having the documents checked in one of of their international branches.

It wouldn't be a big issue cause I'm often in SG.

I have to say I didn't know Internaxx and it sounds good. I'm searching for flaws the app for example seems quite ugly.

 

[BlueMist]

It wouldn't be a big issue cause I'm often in SG.

I have to say I didn't know Internaxx and it sounds good. I'm searching for flaws the app for example seems quite ugly.

Then you can go to their main branch on Battery Road and see if they can open one for you. I have been banking with them for several years and I rarely had any issues.

I would say the biggest flaw of Internaxx is a security, as your account is only protected by random letters from the password and client account number. But this is supposed to change early next year as they are going to merge the platform with SQ it seems. On the other hand they allow only incoming and outgoing transfers in your name. In order to open the account you have to courier the documents to them and sometimes they may ask for true copy of the passport. Apart from all these and KYC documents submitted, once the account was opened and I deposited €200k+ they froze the transfer and asked for further supporting documents showing the source of money etc. And it seems they are pretty peculiar about it, so I am sure every time I send more, they will ask for supporting documents again.

 

[Martin Everson]

I checked Paribas Luxembourg and it looks like they offer term deposits. I am also looking for another broker other than IB, SQ which offers terms deposits. Do you know any ? Thanks.

You need to understand counterparty risk with using term deposits from joker brokers and banks. 100% of your money is gone in worse case if broker is outside EU.

If you got a lump sum in USD then use BGL BNP Paribas and stick your cash in their AAA rated INSTICASH (LU0783285330) fund .

 

[Martin Everson]

What's your opinion about Internaxx?

I use them for a specific purpose so am not a heavy user of them. I think they have a bad rep in their home market but I have not had an issue yet. As a broker they also give me access to a funds I cannot get access to with IB or Saxo. They are also very expat focused so that's a plus.

 

[Martin Everson]

Apart from all these and KYC documents submitted, once the account was opened and I deposited €200k+ they froze the transfer and asked for further supporting documents showing the source of money etc.

The sending of paper form documents is same with KeyTrade Bank in Lux...and so is the freezing .

 

[rowena]

You need to understand counterparty risk with using term deposits from joker brokers and banks. 100% of your money is gone in worse case if broker is outside EU.

If you got a lump sum in USD then use BGL BNP Paribas and stick your cash in their AAA rated INSTICASH (LU0783285330) fund .

Yes, I know that counterparty thing with brokers. BGL NBP Paripas looks promising. I will apply but are they strict about KYC thing? I am using IB & SQ and deposited $800K in 2 years and they never asked any question or source of money documents etc(of course I always deposit from my personal account)... Is this the same with Paripas ? I don't want to deal with preparing documents for my island offshore companies.

 

[Martin Everson]

I will apply but are they strict about KYC thing?

Not 100% sure as my assets came in via anther entity of the BNP group. I had discussed this with my assigned banker before hand so never had any issues.

I am using IB & SQ and deposited $800K in 2 years and they never asked any question or source of money documents etc(of course I always deposit from my personal account)... Is this the same with Paripas ?

No

They will ask you for source of funds and proof. BNP Paribas is a "A" rated bank and not a near junk rated firm like IB has become so expect some hassle and just work around it. The service is focused on foreigners so they won't treat you like a leper for coming to them.

 

[BlueMist]

You need to understand counterparty risk with using term deposits from joker brokers and banks. 100% of your money is gone in worse case if broker is outside EU.

If you got a lump sum in USD then use BGL BNP Paribas and stick your cash in their AAA rated INSTICASH (LU0783285330) fund .

Do they have EUR equivalent of the same?

 

[Martin Everson]

Do they have EUR equivalent of the same?

Yes LU0167237543 but it is negative yielding as Euro cash rates are negative yielding.

 

[moneyhoney]

I write again on this topic regarding INTERNAXX: I'm not resident in my home country but they want to report in my form anyway my TIN of that (together with the new residence country). What do you think about it? I'm ok even if they share but I'd rather prefer not.

 

[BlueMist]

I write again on this topic regarding INTERNAXX: I'm not resident in my home country but they want to report in my form anyway my TIN of that (together with the new residence country). What do you think about it? I'm ok even if they share but I'd rather prefer not.

Why don't you say you don't have one in your home country? Are you sure they are asking about TIN in both countries? I just checked my application form and for home country they just ask for national identification number, but that's different than TIN.

 

[moneyhoney]

Why don't you say you don't have one in your home country? Are you sure they are asking about TIN in both countries? I just checked my application form and for home country they just ask for national identification number, but that's different than TIN.

I think I'll try to fill the application again (I did few weeks ago, printed it but not shipped), but in the email I sent them to clarify this point they said they need both.

 

[Martin Everson]

I just checked my application form and for home country they just ask for national identification number, but that's different than TIN.

It is dependent on the table below what they may ask for. In some countries National ID number is the TIN.

http://www.oecd.org/tax/automatic-e...on-and-assistance/tax-identification-numbers/