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- Thread starter akao
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Dude that's not the point - the only reason you incorporate a company (anywhere) is to put a limit between your personal revenue / profit / losses - and the company's revenue / profit. There's a company bank account, a company revenue, company filings, etc - until that money is out of the company and into your personal bank account (thought dividents, salary, etc) - you didn't make any money, so there's nothing to declare - it's just the company's money - and the company pays corporate tax (or revenue / profit tax) itself.
Hint: That corporate income tax needs to be paid in your home country.
But clearly you are smarter than everyone else on this forum. I don’t think we can help you, unfortunately.
But I’m sure you will find someone willing to take your money and open the company for you. I hope you’ll have internet access in jail, so you can update this thread one day.
Good luck!
But clearly you are smarter than everyone else on this forum. I don’t think we can help you, unfortunately.
But I’m sure you will find someone willing to take your money and open the company for you. I hope you’ll have internet access in jail, so you can update this thread one day.
Good luck!
why all the hate? i didn't ask for someone to open a company for me? i just asked about options for ecommerce / dropshipping - you started going offtopic with the taxes and stuff... i'm not sure you understand how companies actually work...
Several people told you it’s not possible the way you believe. No, you can’t avoid CIT in your home country, even if you don’t pay out anything - unless you build substance or move. No, you can’t avoid accounting requirements - unless you build substance or move.
The only way it’s possible is to not declare anything and hope you won’t be caught - which is illegal.
You keep insisting it has to be possible and legal. All of us here are mistaken.
So the only option left is to let you find out for yourself.
The only way it’s possible is to not declare anything and hope you won’t be caught - which is illegal.
You keep insisting it has to be possible and legal. All of us here are mistaken.
So the only option left is to let you find out for yourself.
again, you're missing the point, or you just can't read. i only asked for a jurisdiction that does not require so much paperwork - you were the one that said it's not legal - if may be or not be legal for you - i'm just looking for a country where i can set up a company to do ecommerce with minimal hassle. i will do (and pay) my own personal taxes. i will go to jail or not, that's my problem.
now can you recommend a jurisdiction for my needs or not?
Sorry to jump in the middle of you fight guys, But any idea on above ^?
HK was my main option as well - i have not been able to find a way to open a bank account in HK - you have to go to the bank and then wait some 1-2 weeks and then go again to sign everything (i have friends in HK). best option would be to open a bank account in Singapore - banks there allow remote opening now with the covid situation - but credit card processors don't look good at you if the company and bank account are located in different countries.
and also, like some people said in this thread, you might go to jail - no good Hong Kong - pay taxes you need
btw, who's setting up your company in HK? and more importantly, how will be doing your accounting? i'm looking for options...
You don’t go to jail for opening a company in Hong Kong.
You go to jail if you live in a high-tax country and the company has no substance and you don’t pay the corporate income tax in your home country and they find out.
Several factors that must come together, but you’re on track so far.
You go to jail if you live in a high-tax country and the company has no substance and you don’t pay the corporate income tax in your home country and they find out.
Several factors that must come together, but you’re on track so far.
please enlighten me... let's say we have the following situation. i live in Belgium and my company is registered in France (or even better, Estonia - as that's viewed as good jurisdiction to incorporate). the company makes $100k revenue in one year - how much tax do i have to pay myself in Belgium (and most importantly, why)?
“A company is considered to be a resident of Belgium for tax purposes if it has its principal place of business or its seat of management in Belgium. The seat of management has been defined by Belgian case law as the place from where directing impulsions emanate or the place where the company's effective management and central administration abide, meaning the place where the corporate decision-making process actually takes place.”
“As of tax year 2019 (financial years ending 31 December 2018 and later), CIT is levied at a rate of 29% plus a 2% crisis tax, which is a surtax, implying an effective rate of 29.58% (the prior effective rate amounted to 33.99%). This rate applies to both Belgian companies (subject to Belgian CIT) and Belgian PEs of foreign companies (subject to Belgian non-resident CIT).”
“
A post office box in a foreign country is no longer sufficient to claim residency abroad. Cross-border tax initiatives like the OECD’s base erosion and profit shifting (BEPS) framework and various EU initiatives mean your organisation must demonstrate adequate substance in countries where you operate.
You need senior management and business operations on location. Insufficient substance can lead to double taxation and challenges by multiple tax authorities.”
www.pwc.be
For the case of Belgium-France, consider Article 1 (4) from the tax treaty:
Belgium - Corporate - Corporate residence
Detailed description of corporate residence rules in Belgium
taxsummaries.pwc.com
“As of tax year 2019 (financial years ending 31 December 2018 and later), CIT is levied at a rate of 29% plus a 2% crisis tax, which is a surtax, implying an effective rate of 29.58% (the prior effective rate amounted to 33.99%). This rate applies to both Belgian companies (subject to Belgian CIT) and Belgian PEs of foreign companies (subject to Belgian non-resident CIT).”
Belgium - Corporate - Taxes on corporate income
Detailed description of taxes on corporate income in Belgium
taxsummaries.pwc.com
“
A post office box in a foreign country is no longer sufficient to claim residency abroad. Cross-border tax initiatives like the OECD’s base erosion and profit shifting (BEPS) framework and various EU initiatives mean your organisation must demonstrate adequate substance in countries where you operate.
You need senior management and business operations on location. Insufficient substance can lead to double taxation and challenges by multiple tax authorities.”
Substance and permanent establishment review
To qualify as a tax resident company and avoid potential double taxation, you must have and maintain sufficient substance in the countries where you do business. PwC can help.
For the case of Belgium-France, consider Article 1 (4) from the tax treaty:
For opening a Paypal and Stripe account, company and bank account must be in the same country, so opening the company in HK and then bank account in Singapore or Switzerland is not gonna work.
Also, I'm not trying to avoid paying taxes in my home country and I'm well aware that i need to pay taxes on my profit from outside of my home country. (that's not what im asking)
What I want to know is if anyone here used currenxie or airwallex with PayPal & Stripe, paying for Facebook ads, Google ads etc
What im trying to avoid is to pay for a company formation in HK and then open a business account with currenxie or airwallex and then see Stripe, Paypal, Facebook Ads don't accept this bank as a payment method/bank
Also, I'm not trying to avoid paying taxes in my home country and I'm well aware that i need to pay taxes on my profit from outside of my home country. (that's not what im asking)
What I want to know is if anyone here used currenxie or airwallex with PayPal & Stripe, paying for Facebook ads, Google ads etc
What im trying to avoid is to pay for a company formation in HK and then open a business account with currenxie or airwallex and then see Stripe, Paypal, Facebook Ads don't accept this bank as a payment method/bank
Thank you but still that does answer the question. The company is registered in Estonia and the main place of business is Estonia (office, secretary, all the what not), the decision-making is in Estonia...
I (the individual shareholder) am reside in Belgium - so why should my Estonian company pay taxes to Belgium and not to Estonia?
I (the individual shareholder) am reside in Belgium - so why should my Estonian company pay taxes to Belgium and not to Estonia?
I'm in the exact same situation - i've been looking for a solution for 2 months - nothing yet... PayPal may work with currenxie or other things (tried it with revolut and it works) - Stipe will not...
That is what is called economic substance. In that case the CIT is payed in Estonia or France or Hong Kong. As we have said all along. But it will cost money to have the office, employees etc. It’s not “cheap,” as you asked.
is your Revoult account a business account or a personal one? Do you currently have an HK company? any idea if you can use Revoult to pay for Facebook ads?
I have a revolut personal account and that was the one i used. for the HK company, i didn't decide yet - still looking for other options, setting up the company should be cheap, you can try NEATcommerce - they're pretty official so they won't scam you - or any other HK based company (lots and lots of them). The only big problem with HK is that you need to do accounting and also auditing - and that will cost (especially if you're a startup with little to no revenue). I didn't try revolut + fb, i hear it works (not sure for how long)
Having a company registered anywhere actually requires a Local Registered Address of some sorts and sometimes a secretary is also required by law. If you don't have these, you don't get your registration. So substance is already there once you register your company in a specific country.
So since all companies have these when they register - it means they pay taxes where they are registered, not where the owner / stakeholder is located. And yes, there's a yearly or monthly fee for the office or secretary - but it's quite cheap (central London office is $25 per month - secretary is $100 per year). I would not consider that expensive at all...
So no registered company will pay taxes outside of it's registration country - i hope we can agree to that...
LOL! Seriously dude. That is NOT substance.
Economic substance is something substantial. It’s not an office for $100. It’s a local director who gets paid a regular salary for that country. Potentially other employees. Etc. etc.
Basically anything that shows that you have proper operations in that country and that it’s not just a shell company which you set up from your computer in Belgium.
I even sent you links to Pwc articles. You could also ask a local tax advisor. Hell, you could even ask your local tax office and get a free confirmation of what we’ve been telling you. But you prefer to close your eyes to reality and believe what you want. Fine.
Why do you think so many people in this forum ask how they can register anonymous companies and avoid reporting to their home countries? Why do you think anyone would use a Belgian company to for their online business if they could just incorporate in some other country and no longer pay any taxes?
Do you think the Belgian policymakers just shrug when they find out that their citizens no longer pay corporate income tax because they found someone in Hong Kong who will scan mail for them for $100 a month? Are we living on the same planet?
Economic substance is something substantial. It’s not an office for $100. It’s a local director who gets paid a regular salary for that country. Potentially other employees. Etc. etc.
Basically anything that shows that you have proper operations in that country and that it’s not just a shell company which you set up from your computer in Belgium.
I even sent you links to Pwc articles. You could also ask a local tax advisor. Hell, you could even ask your local tax office and get a free confirmation of what we’ve been telling you. But you prefer to close your eyes to reality and believe what you want. Fine.
Why do you think so many people in this forum ask how they can register anonymous companies and avoid reporting to their home countries? Why do you think anyone would use a Belgian company to for their online business if they could just incorporate in some other country and no longer pay any taxes?
Do you think the Belgian policymakers just shrug when they find out that their citizens no longer pay corporate income tax because they found someone in Hong Kong who will scan mail for them for $100 a month? Are we living on the same planet?
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