dual citizenship and name

[void]

Let's assume a person is a citizen of two countries (has two passports) - one original issued by country allowing dual citizenship and the other one issued by another (compatible) country (e.g. from CBI program).
Can this person legally change its name in one of the countries and keep the name in the other one (or even change the name in both countries)?
I don't see any reason why not since name is probably just a (common) legal construction of each jurisdiction. Not mentioning the fact that the original country doesn't need to know (is not necessarily told by anyone) that a person got another citizenship.
Could you please share your experience and knowledge regarding this topic?

 

[OTR365]

Happens all the time. For example, a Brazilian woman moves to the U.K., marries there and gets a UK passport. Now her family name in Brazilian passport is "Fonseca-Santos" and in the U.K. passport, "Smith". She acquired a 2nd identity, unintentionally. There is a correct procedure for marrying abroad, but people often find out about it afterwards and correcting it may involve lots of bureaucracy. If she decides not to correct it, Brazil will renew the "Fonseca-Santos" passport without any problems. Likewise, the UK will renew the "Smith" passport.

While the above is a special case, it is not uncommon. The same person can hold two different names in two jurisdictions. Whether you or me can do this, depends mainly if the countries involved make changing names easy or difficult.

It becomes even more interesting if you think about possibilities with bank accounts, companies etc.

 

[void]

Thanks for your insights.
You more or less see it the way that you can act like a totally independent individual in every way in the eyes of each jurisdiction, right?
There are really interesting implications indeed - for instance your original/home country cannot technically know about your properties and bank accounts held using your other passport (the better if the name is different). Well you're probably supposed to share this information filling the CRS forms if you're a tax resident elsewhere but in general it's a really good level of protection I guess.
Wonder why people don't use it that much (or maybe they do, we just don't know) because if you have something serious to protect you can often afford to get another passport.

So basically one can visit his home country using the other passport with another name and nobody knows that you're back and then gone again? Interesting...

 

[OTR365]

So basically one can visit his home country using the other passport with another name and nobody knows that you're back and then gone again? Interesting...

No, because most Western passports are biometric. Double NO if one of the countries is an advanced surveillance society like the United States or the U.K.

In addition to biometric passports, some countries have cameras at the border that scan people for their unique facial features (distance between eyes, mouth etc.). Each face is compared to a database to find matches. The main purpose is to single out wanted criminals and those traveling with another/fake identity. My country of birth (North Europe) is planning to use a system like that in the near future, and certainly some countries already have systems like that.

CRS/AEOI/UBO weakens privacy, and there are no easy workarounds. If I:
1. got a new passport with a different name in a less sophisticated banana republic
2. did not report this to my home country
3. never showed my banana republic passport in my home country

Then I might be able to open bank accounts in some 3rd countries and they would only CRS-report to the banana republic. But this only for as long as I managed to maintain a good passport usage hygiene. Countries collect more and more biometric information. It is only a question of time when e.g. in the EU they start cross-checking their databases.

If I absolutely wanted to visit my home country (in Schengen area) with a banana republic passport, I would get a flight that lands in the neighboring Schengen country and cross the border by car, train etc. In this way I would not need to show my banana passport to my home country's custom officials.

 

[JimBeam]

I have pretty much this situation. Have two passports with (slightly) different names. No major issues. Just be careful when buying tickets or leaving/entering the country you live in.

 

[void]

Just be careful when buying tickets or leaving/entering the country you live in.

can you be more specific please, what should be taken into account?

when traveling to a "neutral" country that can be entered by either of your passports you simply toss a coin to decide which passport will you use that day? maybe a silly question but I'd really like to understand how it practically works... seem like one can get (relatively cheap) a whole new "identity" this way

 

[void]

also it feels a bit weird passing the gate showing one passport and having the other one in the bag... probably nothing wrong about it but still looks like a movie scene

 

[JimBeam]

can you be more specific please, what should be taken into account?

when traveling to a "neutral" country that can be entered by either of your passports you simply toss a coin to decide which passport will you use that day? maybe a silly question but I'd really like to understand how it practically works... seem like one can get (relatively cheap) a whole new "identity" this way

My first passport is of non-EU country (where I was born). I have one more from EU country. So when entering and exiting my non-EU country I always use my non-EU passport. For all the travel within EU or rest of the world I use the EU passport since I can enter countries easily etc. So I buy plane tickets on that name and I carry two passports all the time... Just have to be careful not to mix them. But so far had zero problems.

also it feels a bit weird passing the gate showing one passport and having the other one in the bag... probably nothing wrong about it but still looks like a movie scene

That's not a problem I guess. My country allows dual-citizenships. There are some countries that don't allow this so than it may be a problem.

 

[ontherun]

@void in the case of CIP/CBI programmes it is basically a matter of don't-ask-don't-tell. The largest audience to any such programme is always Chinese people, and China forbids dual nationality but the receiving states just take a client's money and do not make further mention of them having acquired this nationality. No such automatic exchanges take place, either. Chinese embassies do enlist people on the ground who are to keep a watch on the local Chinese population and report on members of the community who openly confess to having obtained another passport, but this is another topic...

As for a second name, for example, Ireland allows this within the realms of their CIP/CBI programme.

 

[ontherun]

western people have been buying cambodian passports for a long time

 

[Joe Blasco]

western people have been buying cambodian passports for a long time

one must be interested in living in cambodia or totally in despair to buy a cambodian passport. Just go to bank and try to open an account with a cambodian passport. Same applies for all carribean CBI passports which interesting you cannot open an account even in their country of issue, which by theory you are a "citizen"

 

[ontherun]

these people were usually not looking for banking solutions. they were usually people whose own passports were declared invalid by the host country, in order to invalidate the holder's residency documents abroad (which basically all request a valid passport in order to validate their own residency documents) and thus force this person to return to the host country with an emergency passport issued by the host embassy. people who are on the run. fugitives. who own significant debts. etc... most recent example... Dutch megafrauding fugitive couple live happily in Dubai on Cambodian passports - Cambodia Expats Online: Forum | News | Information | Blog

i know this guy in person.

 

[ontherun]

one must be interested in living in cambodia or totally in despair to buy a cambodian passport. Just go to bank and try to open an account with a cambodian passport. Same applies for all carribean CBI passports which interesting you cannot open an account even in their country of issue, which by theory you are a "citizen"

Malta doesn't let CBI passport holders work without a work permit craziness everywhere...

 

[Joe Blasco]

these people were usually not looking for banking solutions. they were usually people whose own passports were declared invalid by the host country, in order to invalidate the holder's residency documents abroad (which basically all request a valid passport in order to validate their own residency documents) and thus force this person to return to the host country with an emergency passport issued by the host embassy. people who are on the run. fugitives. who own significant debts. etc... most recent example... Dutch megafrauding fugitive couple live happily in Dubai on Cambodian passports - Cambodia Expats Online: Forum | News | Information | Blog

i know this guy in

 

[Joe Blasco]

Malta doesn't let CBI passport holders work without a work permit craziness everywhere...

the vast majority of these CBI passports are chinese and arabs + some other third world countries and some russians who want these documents for ease of travelling. It is not a real citizenship , except maybe Dominica, because it is not inherited and one cannot even open a bank account in the country which is " citizen" as you point out especially they require residency which is a minor document than citizenship ! The most hillarious is , than in Antigua for istance , in order to renew his passport one must present a valid passport from another country ! The renewal procedure cannot be done in person to police but only through an agent to extract some $$$$$

 

[Joe Blasco]

Let's assume a person is a citizen of two countries (has two passports) - one original issued by country allowing dual citizenship and the other one issued by another (compatible) country (e.g. from CBI program).
Can this person legally change its name in one of the countries and keep the name in the other one (or even change the name in both countries)?
I don't see any reason why not since name is probably just a (common) legal construction of each jurisdiction. Not mentioning the fact that the original country doesn't need to know (is not necessarily told by anyone) that a person got another citizenship.
Could you please share your experience and knowledge regarding this topic?

Usually changing the name in a CBI passport is totally forbiden. All other true citizens can change their name, CBI " citizens" cannot and there are applicable laws for this...

 

[void]

Usually changing the name in a CBI passport is totally forbiden. All other true citizens can change their name, CBI " citizens" cannot and there are applicable laws for this...

didn't know that, sounds crazy but maybe it's true for less reputable jurisdiction
on the other hand for example Austria has (very expensive in comparison though) CBI program and I'm pretty sure this is a full featured regular citizenship like any other Austrian has - can anybody confirm if I'm right?

 

[Joe Blasco]

didn't know that, sounds crazy but maybe it's true for less reputable jurisdiction
on the other hand for example Austria has (very expensive in comparison though) CBI program and I'm pretty sure this is a full featured regular citizenship like any other Austrian has - can anybody confirm if I'm right?

for Austria i cannot help you, it (was) very rare program and maybe the most expensive. For all the others that run in millions, malta and Cyprus, and the ones for nominally 100000$ and 150000$ per head (St Kitts, Antigua, Grenada, St Lucia, vanuatu) no it is strictly forbiden by law to change name for CBI holder, even in case of marriage! Note that all the other citizens in the carribean can change name, the pseudo citizens cannot! Also if you already changed your name in you original citizenship, in Antigua for instance, your application will be declined by law! There is one exception as i wrote, Dominica which is the most friendly and less discriminating agaiinst CBI holders, there after a year of holding citizenship, a CBI citizen can by court order change his/her name.

 

[Joe Blasco]

Let's assume a person is a citizen of two countries (has two passports) - one original issued by country allowing dual citizenship and the other one issued by another (compatible) country (e.g. from CBI program).
Can this person legally change its name in one of the countries and keep the name in the other one (or even change the name in both countries)?
I don't see any reason why not since name is probably just a (common) legal construction of each jurisdiction. Not mentioning the fact that the original country doesn't need to know (is not necessarily told by anyone) that a person got another citizenship.
Could you please share your experience and knowledge regarding this topic?

I just read this thread today, so politely speaking, most of the people here do not have second-third passports and what they write is under their imagination and the perspective of how things should be BUT are NOT ! You can do whatever you like under a second passport as long as you acquired it legally. FORGET name changing name, you cannot do it under CBI, it is a requirement of EU and US to let them operate bUT you can do it under other countries that do not operate CBI's. One way or the other, technically you are two different persons bsed on nationality. As I wrote in some other thread go to a bank with you one passport from country A open an account and then return the other day with your passport B and your name and bio data written exactly the same way. You will be denied service! What is the catch: it's jurisdiction you are citizen, may tolerate the fact that you are citizen someplace else, but trets you as their citizen only ! for exemple if there is tax or military draft, you cannot go and say listen I am citizen of country B also, so that does not consider me!

 

[void]

I just read this thread today, so politely speaking, most of the people here do not have second-third passports and what they write is under their imagination and the perspective of how things should be BUT are NOT ! You can do whatever you like under a second passport as long as you acquired it legally. FORGET name changing name, you cannot do it under CBI, it is a requirement of EU and US to let them operate bUT you can do it under other countries that do not operate CBI's. One way or the other, technically you are two different persons bsed on nationality. As I wrote in some other thread go to a bank with you one passport from country A open an account and then return the other day with your passport B and your name and bio data written exactly the same way. You will be denied service! What is the catch: it's jurisdiction you are citizen, may tolerate the fact that you are citizen someplace else, but trets you as their citizen only ! for exemple if there is tax or military draft, you cannot go and say listen I am citizen of country B also, so that does not consider me!

what you're saying is not that surprising and I trust your experience with "cheap" CBI passports and limited options no matter how weird it sounds

banks are crazy about regulatory requirements and they need to comply with CRS, FATCA and more bulls**t stuff and they need to know your tax residency which is sometimes more than a bank clerk is able to understand and two or more passports make it even worse (not mentioning the fact they you don't have to be a tax resident of any of the countries you are citizen of)

my motivation is privacy protection and system hacking (not tax evasion or hiding anything illegal) - under these circumstances I can see the possibility of dual passport/name really interesting - hence my original question