Is Saudi Arabia and China looking to ditch the dollar in a new oil deal?

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JackAlabama

Entrepreneur
Just waiting for Saudi's meeting with China PM. That will be an interesting state visit with interesting announcements to come ;). Wonder if they will do the Sword dance like they did for Trump smi(&%.


This will all happen after Ramadan. But still waiting on US to put pressure on Saudi's also for moving closure to China.
Suddenly they need to put pressure on a lot of places at the same time. From El Salvador, to Middle East, Europe and Asia. They will be very busy ;)
 

Martin Everson

Offshore Retiree
Staff member
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Suddenly they need to put pressure on a lot of places at the same time. From El Salvador, to Middle East, Europe and Asia. They will be very busy ;)

Very busy. Maybe over extending their political will.
 

Martin Everson

Offshore Retiree
Staff member
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I think whats meant by US exporting "democracy" is US invasion, overthrowing of existing government, death and destruction i.e Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan etc etc.
 

khinkali

Silver Member
Do you know any other “democracy” exporting goods?

It used to be movies, TV, music, Western brands. Jeans and McDonald's.

The US is now doing Putin's job for him, by withdrawing the export of Western culture. I haven't found any good explanation for this behaviour. If Russia had banned Facebook last year it would have looked very autocratic.
 

FixieHartmann

Active Member
Yup definitely will be. We will see what belt and road really looks like by then. Plus China will be world number one economy officially by then. That means only one thing for US. US will go to war economically and politically with China with the rogue province of Taiwan as the excuse ;). Sadly by then China's deep economic ties will mean the collation of the willing will be much much smaller than that against Russia today. It will be some Europeans and US only maybe....lol.
Maybe I am reading to much into your comment but I can't really understand why you would be happy about the US loosing more and more of its influence in the world. Of course this is all speculation and no one really know what exactly will happen, however personally I'd rather live in a world where the US makes the rules vs China.

I mean, the US certainly has lots of issues and I disagree with lots of their (foreign) policies, nevertheless if you believe in personal freedom, privacy, freedom of speech, capitalism etc. you should definitely prefer them being the number one than China / Russia.

So in contrast to what you are writing, I'd actually hope that they will get their **** together, stop the stupid republicans vs. democrats theater and work on staying on top of their game and in power on a global scale.

Some people may righteously feel some kind of Schadenfreude about the old bully being injured and getting weaker, but I worry that the void that a collapsing US would create would enable some of the worst restrictions of freedom to materialize.
 

EuroKiss

Entrepreneur
It used to be movies, TV, music, Western brands. Jeans and McDonald's.
sorry, but that was 30 years ago…

I worry that the void that a collapsing US would create would enable some of the worst restrictions of freedom to materialize.
worst restrictions already are in place in western countries.
I suggest you to see what happened and it is still happening in Australia and Canada, they made feel North Korea like a heaven on earth.
 

FixieHartmann

Active Member
sorry, but that was 30 years ago…


worst restrictions already are in place in western countries.
I suggest you to see what happened and it is still happening in Australia and Canada, they made feel North Korea like a heaven on earth.
So, in your opinion, what is currently happening in Australia that makes North Korea feel like heaven on earth?
 

khinkali

Silver Member
sorry, but that was 30 years ago…

Human Rights Watch:
In December 2019, parliament adopted amendments to Russia’s consumer protection law that oblige manufacturers to pre-install Russian apps on certain types of devices sold in Russia. Legislators said the initiative aimed at enhancing Russian users’ convenience, offering them apps oriented at Russian speakers, as well as at promoting domestic software.

Incredibly, it isn't Moscow who are removing Netflix from Russian homes.

A new Iron Curtain is being constructed and Washington are pitching in to help with materials.

We could imagine President Xi being quite envious of some of the these "sanctions" and suspensions.
 

Martin Everson

Offshore Retiree
Staff member
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Elite Member
Maybe I am reading to much into your comment but I can't really understand why you would be happy about the US loosing more and more of its influence in the world.

You mean why would I be happy with a world without divide and conquer and endless wars for profit, endless puppet governments, endless US wars because of political differences? Maybe I am wrong for wanting peace.

Of course this is all speculation and no one really know what exactly will happen, however personally I'd rather live in a world where the US makes the rules vs China.

A would rather live in a peaceful world based on rules and mutual respect and equitable relationships between countries. Problem is US does not want this. It wants vessel states and puppet governments it can control and manipulate. It chooses illegal wars i.e Iraq, political meddling i.e Ukraine etc and has no respect for another countries sovereignty.

I mean, the US certainly has lots of issues and I disagree with lots of their (foreign) policies, nevertheless if you believe in personal freedom, privacy, freedom of speech, capitalism etc. you should definitely prefer them being the number one than China / Russia.

Freedom of speech is a major concern. We now communicate mostly via digital media. This digital media is generally privately owned i,e FB, TWT, news networks etc, so you have private companies dictating what can be said on their platforms. Ask Trump who was president of US and banned from using Twitter to communicate, did Freedom of speech help him? Freedom of speech is going away in general sadly. Unless you got a really loud voice your gonna have to use private platforms to get your voice heard. Otherwise freedom of speech will always remain if your just talking with your mate down the pub.

So in contrast to what you are writing, I'd actually hope that they will get their **** together, stop the stupid republicans vs. democrats theater and work on staying on top of their game and in power on a global scale.

I hope US returns to the rule of law and drops the idea that it is the exception to the rule and can do what it wants and when it wants and to who it wants and is accountable to nobody. The illegal war in Iraq and US sanctioning the ICC staff over trying to investigate US war crimes is insane. Only US can do this sort of bullying and get away with it.


The US will however never get it together as it is internally deeply divided like most countries along political lines. The two party system has not served the US well at all.


Some people may righteously feel some kind of Schadenfreude about the old bully being injured and getting weaker, but I worry that the void that a collapsing US would create would enable some of the worst restrictions of freedom to materialize.

Restrictions on freedom will occur whether the US is on top or not. It's the way society is going unfortunately. We are all gonna be less free than we are today regardless of whether the US is on top or not. We will all eventually have our movements tracked and so will our assets and what we do online be tracked etc. Much of the privacy we enjoyed in the past will be gone sadly whether China is number one or US remains number one. Governments want to control society and your personal life. Ask a Canadian trucker protestor about freedoms. The direction is already being set in the west unfortunately. Everything the west criticizes China for they are practicing themselves now without exception. The west is just behind the curve in implementing what China has done to restrict freedoms.
 

JamesDonkey

Active Member
I don't buy into the **** that @Martin Everson often posts here about how "now it's all baaaaaad. But not as bad as it'll become." and his word "sadly" :)

- Man, you can't know the future - you may not make predictions and call them the future. You forget to append "I think" remark to your predictions.

- you can't know what technology will be invented that'll circumvent freedom-inhibiting rules; nowadays we have DEX-es and crypto, and encrypted messengers. Yeah, we're as powerless as we were back in the slavery times, aren't we?

- you make points that prove you appocaliptic points of view, but never touch of on those that dispove them. Aren't there any? Yes, there are -- the ones that prove that we, nowaday, have more freedoms than ever.

- "Oh, it's the pick! From now on everything will go down the hill, straight to digital slavery".

- and even if we make 2 steps forwards and 1 step back, it doesn't mean that we're going backwards. That's simply how human evolusion goes.
 
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Martin Everson

Offshore Retiree
Staff member
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I don't buy into the **** that @Martin Everson often posts here about how "now it's all baaaaaad. But not as bad as it'll become." and his word "sadly" :)

Can you not make a point without swearing or at very least "*" out the majority of the swear word? Come on now :rolleyes:.

- Man, you can't know the future - you may not make predictions and call them the future. You forget to append "I think" remark to your predictions.

Errr...Ok

- you can't know what technology will be invented that'll circumvent freedom-inhibiting rules; nowadays we have DEX-es and crypto, and encrypted messengers. Yeah, we're as powerless as we were back in the slavery times, aren't we?

Errr...Ok

- you make points that prove you appocaliptic points of view, but never touch of on those that dispove them. Aren't there any? Yes, there are -- the ones that prove that we, nowaday, have more freedoms than ever.

Errr...Ok

- "Oh, it's the pick! From now on everything will go down the hill, straight to digital slavery".

Errr...Ok

- and even if we make 2 steps forwards and 1 step back, it doesn't mean that we're going backwards. That's simply how human evolusion goes.

Errr....Ok


Do you feel better now you said all that? Hope you do thu&¤#
 

JamesDonkey

Active Member
Calling the person names instead of addressing his points is the very trait of a troll, Khinkali. :) Let the reader guess who is the troll among us two - you or me.
 

Martin Everson

Offshore Retiree
Staff member
Mentor Group Gold
Elite Member
Hummm Putin has a point. Smart move to support the Ruble however. Damn hopefully things don't move too fast.


----- quote start

Putin also described as “illegitimate” the freezing of Russia’s assets abroad.

He said the United States and the European Union have declared a “real default” on their obligations to Russia.

“Now everyone in the world knows that obligations in dollars can be defaulted,” Putin said.

Immediately after the announcement, the ruble strengthened against the US dollars and the euro.


----- quote end
 

WhiteExpert

New member
Saudi Arabia, well, probably not. Their currency is pegged to the US dollar and they definitely do not see any interest in that. Quite the opposite: they would prefer to sell the oil in the US dollar.
 

Golden Fleece

Entrepreneur
The odds of any Western nation allowing itself to be forced to use Rubles to pay for Russian energy is zero.

In fact, just today French President Macron said that France would take control of some firms in France's energy sector to bolster the nation's energy independence. Russia will not dictate the terms.

Russia continues to shoot itself in the foot. Putin misunderstands the resolve of the West just like the West misunderstands the resolve of China.
 
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