Offshore Pro / International Wealth scam

[GF150]

Has anyone else been recently scammed by Offshore Pro / International Wealth who sold "anonymous" Union Pay
prepaid cards that worked only a couple of weeks and have been useless since May ? They say the reason is some
system security issue they are trying to solve but, of course, the narrative is hard to take seriously after 3+ months.

 

[GF150]

Have a look here:
https://internationalwealth.info/en/services-and-products/anonymous-unionpay-eur-debit-card/
and here:
https://www.offshore-pro.com/no-name-union-pay-eur-debit-card/
They were even selling those cards by the hundred (a few % off, thank you!), valid fall 2025.
All that is now worth a piece of plastic. And these guys are still in the business....

 

[Compliance Circle]

You get what you pay for.

"Anonymous" UP card from PH-based PSP is, by default, risky solution that can go off-rails ANYTIME. It works until it works.

Whilst having no particular personal experience with offshorewealth/offshore pro (heard a couple of very diverse and mixed reviews in the past), I would question your approach to calling out them as "scammers" - you can't really call out "offshore CSP" like OffshoreWealth for "scamming customers" since they do not provide any financial services themselves, but rather just resell solutions according to demands of their high risk clientelle.

On a separate note, I've heard that Volet (ex-advcash) also had a fair share of problems with their Philippines-based Union Pay issuer in the past few years, usually lasting for a few months before those problems being solved/funds refunded. This may give you a general idea on the reliability of those kinds of solutions and determine actual fault share on the part of International Wealth.

Bad marketing targeted at high risk clientelle? Yeah. High-risk product from FSP in a low-grade jurisdiction? Yeah... Excuses by sales monkeys to reduce pressure on themselves? Totally possible.

Outright scam? No, you should've known what you're signing up for.

 

[GF150]

You get what you pay for.

Quite right but do you suggest that the price paid wasn't high enough ? I wouldn't have paid that price for a normal card.
Although I have no trouble whatsoever with any Administration and, besides, nobody is after me for any debt or other dispute, I value privacy and don't want to be spied at everywhere I go and about everything I do.

I would question your approach to calling out them as "scammers"
How would you qualify a merchant that sells something to you that doesn't work the way it should and will do nothing to help you out ? Someone who consistently lie to you just to buy time and scam other people meanwhile ? Generally speaking, someone who knows (or should know) what they sell doesn't work. Offshore Pro and International Wealth aren't just random Companies, instantly come out of the blue. They have been around for some time.

...just resell solutions according to demands of their high risk clientelle.
I beg your pardon but this is just not true. This was a standard product, i.e. for everyone and not a bespoke solution. By no means would I qualify myself as a high-risk person.

Outright scam? No, you should've known what you're signing up for.
Come on! This is very easy a thing to say .... afterwards. You can apply that to any case brought up on this forum. We're all taking risks on seeking freedom. Not exposing scammers is increasing the risk for anyone else, What do you think of that?

 

[GF150]

Bad marketing targeted at high risk clientelle? Yeah. High-risk product from FSP in a low-grade jurisdiction?

Incidentally, can that, by any chance, mean: you should have chosen a better solution, totally risk-free, such as:

"360 Licensing, Compliance, Banking & Business Intelligence Private Consulting for FinTech, Crypto and HNWI's
There's no one size fits all solution - tailored, confidential, expert advisory and unique propositions
Contact Me at | Telegram t.me/compliancecircle | DM Here on OCT for Signal, Session, Jabber etc."

Who can tell Scylla from Charybdis ?

P.S. Sorry, in my previous post a "will" is missing, i.e. "... Someone who will consistently lie...." Can't edit it

 

[Compliance Circle]

Quite right but do you suggest that the price paid wasn't high enough ? I wouldn't have paid that price for a normal card.
Although I have no trouble whatsoever with any Administration and, besides, nobody is after me for any debt or other dispute, I value privacy and don't want to be spied at everywhere I go and about everything I do.

Ok, well, so you went searching for "anonymous no name debit card"... and paid respective premium just to have no name recorded on your

I would question your approach to calling out them as "scammers"
How would you qualify a merchant that sells something to you that doesn't work the way it should and will do nothing to help you out ? Someone who consistently lie to you just to buy time and scam other people meanwhile ? Generally speaking, someone who knows (or should know) what they sell doesn't work. Offshore Pro and International Wealth aren't just random Companies, instantly come out of the blue. They have been around for some time.

Most likely they just rely on you information they get from the card provider itself. Would not have been defensive, if not have seen how Valet (ex-advcash) handled the same issue with Union Pay cards and they were issued by PH-based issuer as well, so can correlate between two situations based on my industry intelligence, that's it.

Again, you get what you pay for. Think again under different angle - you paid for "anonymous debit card" from a 3rd world country issuer, it doesn't matter how much you've paid for that at the mercy of reseller such as OffshoreWealth.

On the issue on who they're - exactly. They're here fore some time, mixed reviews, but they're not just an outright scam operation

...just resell solutions according to demands of their high risk clientelle.
I beg your pardon but this is just not true. This was a standard product, i.e. for everyone and not a bespoke solution. By no means would I qualify myself as a high-risk person.

That's completely true, my friend. OffshoreWealth used to mostly serve ex-USSR clients with "complex wealth sources"

Their marketing strategy is far from being aimed at totally clean clients.

Outright scam? No, you should've known what you're signing up for.
Come on! This is very easy a thing to say .... afterwards. You can apply that to any case brought up on this forum. We're all taking risks on seeking freedom. Not exposing scammers is increasing the risk for anyone else, What do you think of that?

Did you try to contact issuer of the card? Does your legal agreement with issuer imply it's some sort of OffshoreWealth venture, or branding?

 

[Compliance Circle]

Incidentally, can that, by any chance, mean: you should have chosen a better solution, totally risk-free, such as:

"360 Licensing, Compliance, Banking & Business Intelligence Private Consulting for FinTech, Crypto and HNWI's
There's no one size fits all solution - tailored, confidential, expert advisory and unique propositions
Contact Me at | Telegram t.me/compliancecircle | DM Here on OCT for Signal, Session, Jabber etc."

Who can tell Scylla from Charybdis ?

P.S. Sorry, in my previous post a "will" is missing, i.e. "... Someone who will consistently lie...." Can't edit it

No, I don't offer risk-free solutions, as there are none totally risk-free as you know, only tailoring degrees of risk to the needs of my clients

 

[GF150]

Most likely they just rely on you information they get from the card provider itself. Would not have been defensive, if not have seen how Valet (ex-advcash) handled the same issue with Union Pay cards and they were issued by PH-based issuer as well, so can correlate between two situations based on my industry intelligence, that's it.

Not quite sure what you mean if it isn't "everybody should first ask me whatever they intend to undertake"
I can also follow you in your statement re. the ex-USSR clients and their complex business. It's always more or less risky to do business with someone you don't know. If nobody would be willing to take any risk you would have no clients, right ?
Mind, I didn't come here only to complain but also to find out if there were many others caught in this scam, because that is a scam. When you have in hand a card UnionPay, an authentic one, of course, and it works OK you think the deal is fair, because it could have been worse, no need to say that. So, was the scam more elaborate, i.e. the card stops working when you put some more money on it, that is still to be investigated.

Did you try to contact issuer of the card? Does your legal agreement with issuer imply it's some sort of OffshoreWealth venture, or branding?

Yes, I did but they all tell the same story - a security issue that it takes time to solve, etc. Well, you can believe it for some time but eventually enough is enough. In fact, there are several layers but the end issuer (The Bank) is supposed to be a large UP card issuer and I'd rather think of some contract breech between Offshore Pro / International Wealth and the Bank, the latter is not willing to disclose and they have agreed on a narrative.
No, the card doesn't look like a sub-brand. It looks just like an ordinary UP card with no name on it. However, at the Bank it's registered as "No Name" and, consequently, the Bank, yet knowing my identity, does not consider it's abnormal to issue a "No-name" card. The supposed breech must be elsewhere.

 

[GF150]

Sorry, just spotted it : should be "breach" instead of "breech" - my memory is playing tricks to me and I don't use a translator to put things right

 

[Compliance Circle]

Not quite sure what you mean if it isn't "everybody should first ask me whatever they intend to undertake"
I can also follow you in your statement re. the ex-USSR clients and their complex business. It's always more or less risky to do business with someone you don't know. If nobody would be willing to take any risk you would have no clients, right ?
Mind, I didn't come here only to complain but also to find out if there were many others caught in this scam, because that is a scam. When you have in hand a card UnionPay, an authentic one, of course, and it works OK you think the deal is fair, because it could have been worse, no need to say that. So, was the scam more elaborate, i.e. the card stops working when you put some more money on it, that is still to be investigated.

It's not just an "authentic Union Pay card". You can have "authentic Visa/UnionPay/Masercard" in your hand, but ultimately security and fate of your funds is not down to a card scheme, but to the particular issuer. Of course, there are scheme due diligence, scheme operational rules etc. but in the end of the day the don't guarantee anything on the part of issuer credibility, solvency, risk appetite and whatever goes from there.

So when you're placing an order for product marketed as "anonymous Union Pay card", your main argument for the trust you placed was... the fact that it is issued through Union Pay network? Did you take issuer credibility, licensing status, public profile in consideration beforehand?

In my professional lifetime, I've seen countless financial institutions that had SWIFT, card scheme memberships, partnerships etc. and in the essence it has no impact on their operational risk appetite. Believe it or not, when the issuer is comfortable with products issued being marketed by its partners as "anonymous" "no name" it usually has quite high risk tolerance and you can also guess that by looking at their tariffs.

High risk financial products only work until they work, and they tend to exist only for a certain time. They're here in place to satisfy needs of specific client base, "normal" or low risk clients just go elsewhere - to their local banks/global fintechs like revolut and wise since they need none of that "no name anonymous" stuff.

Respectively, offshore agents and intermediaries sell those solutions while they work, knowing they can stop working anytime, just because we live in funny times. That's the sad truth.

Yes, I did but they all tell the same story - a security issue that it takes time to solve, etc. Well, you can believe it for some time but eventually enough is enough. In fact, there are several layers but the end issuer (The Bank) is supposed to be a large UP card issuer and I'd rather think of some contract breech between Offshore Pro / International Wealth and the Bank, the latter is not willing to disclose and they have agreed on a narrative.
No, the card doesn't look like a sub-brand. It looks just like an ordinary UP card with no name on it. However, at the Bank it's registered as "No Name" and, consequently, the Bank, yet knowing my identity, does not consider it's abnormal to issue a "No-name" card. The supposed breech must be elsewhere.

May be. Or may not be. There can be a very complex network of underlying faciliators. I've just tried to explain you how those "anonymous" financial instruments work nowadays. It's 2024, not 2007, mate.

 

[GF150]

Respectively, offshore agents and intermediaries sell those solutions while they work, knowing they can stop working anytime, just because we live in funny times. That's the sad truth.

Yes, I'm with you and that's where the scam lies. So, basically, you take the risk to come across "hard scammers" who take your money and don't send you your card or "soft scammers" that send you a card that work just a few weeks and they know that.
However, both are scammers. You put some money on stake. You can lose it. OK, but just saying nothing is stupid. At least you should warn the other people with whom you have something in common, shouldn't you ?

Did you take issuer credibility, licensing status, public profile in consideration beforehand?

Of course, but that didn't help. Do you really think that the folk that advertise on this very site are risk-free ? Have a look at some of my posts. When I ask them a sensible question they will not reply or will go on with some smoky ready-made speech that says nothing in term of information. Everything is more or less risky when you don't follow the crowd and even when you do.

By the way, you call yourself a knowledgeable professional. OK, so be it. You even don't say you are risk-free. Nevertheless, just imagine the situation: would it be reasonable to pay you 1 000 bucks for telling me how to avoid losing $500 in a scam scheme ? It would be something like the car dealer who loses $500 on each sale but hopes to catch up on quantity !
Every move is risky and the only thing to do when you're scammed is to share your experience with the community. At least, that will hopefully help somebody.

 

[AlicaFunk]

Quite right but do you suggest that the price paid wasn't high enough ? I wouldn't have paid that price for a normal card.

how much did you pay for the card ? Try @AlexPCS his service is famous and reputable seller here.

 

[GF150]

The price is still on the sites of International Wealth (however, there's a notice "Service no more available") and Offshore Pro (no such notice). They belong to the same group. It's in the 600 € for ~2 years of validity (3-4 weeks in reality ) plus shipping fees.
Plus, they promised that only shipping fees would apply on a subsequent renewal.
"Les promesses n'engagent que ceux qui y croient" (Promises are only binding on those who believe in them)
I know AlexPCS, thank you.

 

[Compliance Circle]

Yes, I'm with you and that's where the scam lies. So, basically, you take the risk to come across "hard scammers" who take your money and don't send you your card or "soft scammers" that send you a card that work just a few weeks and they know that.
However, both are scammers. You put some money on stake. You can lose it. OK, but just saying nothing is stupid. At least you should warn the other people with whom you have something in common, shouldn't you ?

In common sense I can understand where your opinion is coming from. However, it's reality that happens all the time when you deal with high-risk financial products and those who issue, market and sell them. There's no warranty and those solutions come and go. Let me give you FMCG example - could we call resellers on Amazon (i.e. regular buyers) of Juicero (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juicero) scammers if they re-sold you the juicer and one month later company ceased its operations? Don't think so.

Of course, but that didn't help. Do you really think that the folk that advertise on this very site are risk-free ? Have a look at some of my posts. When I ask them a sensible question they will not reply or will go on with some smoky ready-made speech that says nothing in term of information. Everything is more or less risky when you don't follow the crowd and even when you do.

Noted. Not getting into philosophy disputes...

By the way, you call yourself a knowledgeable professional. OK, so be it. You even don't say you are risk-free. Nevertheless, just imagine the situation: would it be reasonable to pay you 1 000 bucks for telling me how to avoid losing $500 in a scam scheme ? It would be something like the car dealer who loses $500 on each sale but hopes to catch up on quantity !
Every move is risky and the only thing to do when you're scammed is to share your experience with the community. At least, that will hopefully help somebody.

It's your choice. You have your own brain, willpower, public due diligence instruments available, as well as common sense. Many times issues of anonymous financial instruments were discussed on OCT...

I just came up to this topic because this forum is no kind of Trustpilot and we can freely share professional, motivated and argumented feedback on complex issues which arise from one or another accusation.

My opinion is still the same - I simply don't believe calling this a scam if the card has worked for at least a few weeks as you state is right. Reasoning: it was A HIGH-RISK FINANCIAL INSTRUMENT that no one in the right mind could have promissed to last for months/years/decades to come. So that worked until that worked.

 

[GF150]

My opinion is still the same - I simply don't believe calling this a scam if the card has worked for at least a few weeks as you state is right. Reasoning: it was A HIGH-RISK FINANCIAL INSTRUMENT that no one in the right mind could have promised to last for months/years/decades to come. So that worked until that worked.

OK. What I don't quite catch is why you seem to be advocating for scammers and putting de facto a blame on scammed. This is shear truth. The fact is that the product in question wasn't supposed to be a high-risk one (*) and, besides, (see the text in bold characters above) the scammers made that promise, whether you like it or not. I would be very curious to know if you'd serve the same version to your would-be clients, e.g. "you give me good real money and I have for you a solution which will work as long as it will work". Not sure I'd buy that. So, if you want my money, you'll have to put things the other way round knowing that you are cheating. I call that a scam.
(*) BTW, why is it so difficult to make you understand that that wasn't a fully anonymous card because the Bank had my identity.
It was just anonymous for those who don't have to know who you are when you buy a bottle of wine and pay for it. Is a 10- quid note a high-risk financial instrument ?

 

[diro]

You need to learn the definition of a SCAM - if you pay for something you don't get that's a scam. If you pay for something you get but which stop working after some time because of outer circumstances, well that's not a scam.

 

[GF150]

Thank you for your support ! However, you should carefully read my posts.
If you buy a new (or otherwise guaranteed) car and it can only bring you home and then stops, would you apply the same rule ?
A deal is a deal. If it's dishonest(*) from seller's part, it's a scam. That's a valid definition. There are many different scams,
from a "still good" tube ticket to a carefully designed Ponzi scheme and covid "epidemics" (the greatest of them all).
BTW, you introduce yourself as an Offshore Agent. Do you sell to your clients services that may or may not work, depending of something you can't/won't tell ? Will you keep their money if your solution will not work ? Do you accept to be paid only if the clients get what they pay for ? "You may think I'm a dreamer, But I'm not the only one..." (hopefully.)
(*) Why dishonest ? It's explained in my previous posts.
Anyone else to take the scammers' side ?

 

[brianK]

If you buy a new (or otherwise guaranteed) car and it can only bring you home and then stops, would you apply the same rule ?

I would go to the car dealer and get it fixed! Still it is not a scam!

 

[GF150]

I would go to the car dealer and get it fixed! Still it is not a scam!

Ah, you would go, would you ! And what if you found their door closed and nobody to answer a call ? Have you ever thought of this eventuality before posting ? Of course, an incident is always possible and, in my case, I took it that way while it could reasonably be seen as an incident. I wouldn't have called it a scam and posted here, had they fixed the problem or had they given me my money (*) back if they can't. No such thing happened. And it's even much worse because the only way to get my deposit back is to use another card which, by the way, is very different and, to top the bill, that one is also worth a piece of plastic because I received it over a month ago but have no PIN and no activation data. Plus, I have no (new) account data where my other (UP) account funds should have been transferred. No such thing has happened for months and I call that a scam, whether you like it or not. BTW, what is your main reason for taking the scammers' (Offshore Pro Group/International Wealth) side ? Are you in their business, by any chance ? Just asking....
(*) my deposit and the cost of the card that's worth nothing but I paid good money for it.

 

[uplana]

LoL yeah @brianK is a agent for this operation.

What is wrong with people the last few weeks