Let's Talk About Africa

[flyinglow]

I personally think Africa is one of the most underrated places on Earth. I'm not talking in a touristic or cultural sense, but rather economically.

First off, being of South African descent, I understand the multitude of problems that underlie a lot of African nations. This traditionally makes people in the west write off anything to do with Africa. A lot of people still have it in their heads that Africa is a primitive place with nothing going for it.

But would I be wrong in saying Africa is primed for growth in the coming decades? With one of the youngest populations in the world, an abundance of natural resources, and some already well-managed African countries (Tanzania, Ghana, Kenya to name a few), could we see Africa mobilise to experience an economic boom reminiscent of China's in past decades? In addition to this, the COVID hysteria in Africa is non-existent in all countries bar a few. Even in more 'westernised' African countries like South Africa, the hysteria is not that bad.

Would like to have a lively debate about the future of Africa and if it could potentially see massive growth while the west experiences massive decline.

 

[troubled soul]

How Rwanda is Becoming the Singapore of Africa​

 

[uplana]

Well, if you have a few millions a year to buy property that is guarded as well to have armed security staff 24/7 regardless where you are then I'm sure Africa is a nice place to live, otherwise I would not consider it.

 

[pipona]

Well, if you have a few millions a year to buy property that is guarded as well to have armed security staff 24/7 regardless where you are then I'm sure Africa is a nice place to live, otherwise I would not consider it.

the OP said economically, not as a place to live.

Africa is a very exciting place. There are tons of opportunities right now across the continent.

 

[ypmh786]

I thoroughly agree...I am Australian born and have spent the last 10 years in South Africa and the last 15 in southern Africa. There are annoying things - an Amazon order isn't as straight forward and security is of course always a concern but the opportunities are astounding. I don't particularly feel that investing in massive projects is the way to go with all of the corruption (and I feel this is what turns most people off - if you come wanting to invest millions then every man and his dog wants a kickback) but if you have US$100k+ then you can easily set up something under the radar. Base yourself offshore and target a market in which you have experience. Accept that there are efficiency losses in the workforce and plan accordingly. And be careful about any partnership. If Africa sort out their nepotism and corruption then they will see massive growth.

 

[EuroKiss]

As a EU living in Latin America I understand pretty well the opportunities in the developing countries, but honestly I still don’t get what opportunities Africa can offer. I mean, we all saw what happened in South Africa a couple of weeks ago, they still have a tribal mentality that makes a Swiss knife a technologically overrated tool.

 

[369]

As a EU living in Latin America I understand pretty well the opportunities in the developing countries, but honestly I still don’t get what opportunities Africa can offer. I mean, we all saw what happened in South Africa a couple of weeks ago, they still have a tribal mentality that makes a Swiss knife a technologically overrated tool.

Opportunities are big like eastern europe in the beginning of 2000's or later asia.
The issue you are talking about is in my opinion a targeted movement against white people you can find now nearly everywhere in the world just maybe not so dramatic like in south africa.Africa is a good place for business but you should always have a place b where you can stay longer should it get more complicated there.

For me personly Zanzibar and Mauritius sound like a good solution.
0% tax in Zanzibar and being also a resident in Mauritius with a company which is quite safe also in conflicts between religions and which also gives you the possibility to obtain a nice passport after 2-5 years.

The only conflict i personly have about Zanzibar is that it is nearly fully islamic and i don't know the people enough how they would react on a big conflict between islam/christianity if it would be a safe place to stay as a white christian

 

[Martin Everson]

I agree with OP. He touched on a few points that are interesting including have a very young population on the continent which is important. Plenty of places are livable in Africa. People forget that Africa as a continent is indeed the richest continent in the world in terms of resources. However wealth distribution is terrible. You can go to countries like Nigeria and see absolute wealth that will make the average wealthy European seem like a peasant and that will be beside people living on rubbish dump.

I was staying in Mooikloof just outside Johannesburg some years ago and traveled down to Camps Bay in Cape Town and realized there is some hidden gems in Africa. Even in Namibia and Nigeria aside from Mauritius and Seychelles you can find very nice areas to live. African countries are so vast and vary wildly within each one. You can have absolute poverty and crime alongside extreme wealth and luxury.

The continent has not reached anything near its true potential due to years of colonization and legacy issues surrounding the corrupt power structures left in place that simply do not work with tribal societies. We witnessed this with Afghanistan after 20 years of western control and foreign values imposed on them the country has reverted to something the people understand. The continent will find its feet eventually. If they can break away from continued western interference and implement systems of government that works for all ethnic groups within each country they will do well eventually. Africa's rise may happen after China's eventual rise but the political system needs to change. Democracy as in the west will never help Africa evolve.

 

[EuroKiss]

Opportunities are big like eastern europe in the beginning of 2000's or later asia.
The issue you are talking about is in my opinion a targeted movement against white people you can find now nearly everywhere in the world just maybe not so dramatic like in south africa.Africa is a good place for business but you should always have a place b where you can stay longer should it get more complicated there.

For me personly Zanzibar and Mauritius sound like a good solution.
0% tax in Zanzibar and being also a resident in Mauritius with a company which is quite safe also in conflicts between religions and which also gives you the possibility to obtain a nice passport after 2-5 years.

The only conflict i personly have about Zanzibar is that it is nearly fully islamic and i don't know the people enough how they would react on a big conflict between islam/christianity if it would be a safe place to stay as a white christian

You mentioned Zanzibar and Mauritius on a tax solution stand-point but it is like saying Dubai is a land of business opportunities since their tax situation, which isn’t unless you can cash out big BIG money.
Let me land this: what kind of business (since I guess we are talking about biz in this thread) do you think a white man can have success in Africa? Hotel industry? Mining industry? E-commerce?
I see soooo many problems everywhere!

 

[Martin Everson]

Let me land this: what kind of business (since I guess we are talking about biz in this thread) do you think a white man can have success in Africa? Hotel industry? Mining industry? E-commerce?

White people are having success in all those areas if not dominating especially mining.

 

[ypmh786]

Traditionally because of apartheid all of the business owners are white. Whilst that is slowly changing there is an obvious skew in the wealth demographic. Taking a drive from Houghton Estate to the Alexandra township demonstrates that beautifully. I challenge anyone to find an area with more Porsches per head of population than Houghton. It still shocks me.

I am a white foreigner doing business and I am having success (although I realise that is a relative term). Coming from an engineering background I see more opportunity to make money in southern Africa than in Australia and the UK (where I have previously been). Yes there is risk but then it depends on your appetite. If you don't want to invest in shares on the stock market then put your money in a bank account. The risk is far lower but so is the return. Those people who live or have lived in South Africa understand that there are riots and what you need to do during those times. Before going to South Africa I had a completely different view of the country. Time here has given me a greater understanding of the risk profile.

There are over a billion consumers on the African continent. Whilst there are large portions in poverty there is a massive market. Everyone overlooks Africa. Africa uses steel and concrete and does construction. African people have 5G and smart phones and computers. People here eat and buy Coke and order Uber and have take away delivered.

To anyone else who has worked or lived in South Africa I have a question - do you believe that there are opportunities due to the inefficiencies inherent from apartheid?

 

[EuroKiss]

White people are having success in all those areas if not dominating especially mining.

I badly expressed myself; I am talking about a “new entry”, and with a limited investment capacity - I mean, with $500 millions of course mining can be an excellent opportunity.

 

[369]

I badly expressed myself; I am talking about a “new entry”, and with a limited investment capacity - I mean, with $500 millions of course mining can be an excellent opportunity.

There are mining opportunities starting at $100k .
Very often there are locals who own land and found a gold vain but have not the budget to mine it other than with a shovel and a pickaxe

 

[Martin Everson]

There are mining opportunities starting at $100k .
Very often there are locals who own land and found a gold vain but have not the budget to mine it other than with a shovel and a pickaxe

Exactly, artisanal mining is common in Africa. There are ways to make money with obtaining an exploration or full mining license from a local or simply partnering as an equity partner.

 

[Alexk]

No problems with Africa. Plenty of opportunities and abundance of the risks. But this is what makes life exciting, don't you think? A good movie about some opportunities is Blood Diamond. The tax systems are very similar to the rest of the World, with less supervision from the State of how you do and what you do with your money.

 

[Marc Rich]

Africa is fantastic, so many business opportunities. Especially in online gambling and fintech. Was recently in Kenya, going next month to Nigeria All you need is a good 4x4 SUV and some street-smarts

 

[Martin Everson]

Btw the real Marc Rich was an interesting guy not scared to do a deal with anyone in any country. I knew a lot about him .

 

[EuroKiss]

All you need is a good 4x4 SUV and some street-smarts

a bunch of Wagner contractors wouldn’t hurt too…

 

[Martin Everson]

Yeah Wagner group is in Mali now. Russia playing the long game in Africa.

 

[Marc Rich]

Btw the real Marc Rich was an interesting guy not scared to do a deal with anyone in any country. I knew a lot about him .

yes likewise, I am truly fascinated by him and have read his book many times. Have had a few ex-Glencore clients who would share some stories about him too.