credtiors want their money, can a Swiss company protect you?

bastard

Trusted Member
Business Angel
I have a problem which I have thought about for a very long time. I have a friend whos is hunted by local creditors he owe money including the tax authorities in his country. What we have discuss so far is to have the company in his wife name it can solve the problem here and now but if she runs everything is lost.

Now we discuss to setup a Swiss private company which can or can't protect his assets and company from being taken by the bad guys.

Does someone here has a good idea which is possible to do and keep the bad guys away?
 

lbh411

New Member
crypto could be a solution to protect and hide? I assume if tax officials could seize company assets
 

bastard

Trusted Member
Business Angel
Yeah crypto is a way of hiding your identity but it is risky and very volatile except it is not possible to buy real estate and such without to provide either a company neme or persons name.
 

Sols

Trusted Member
Business Angel
There are a lot of risk factors to consider. The limitation of liability of a company would only protect you from non-criminal wrongdoings by the company, not from past activities. If it's proven that the funds used to build the company were of criminal origin, the limitation of liability would probably not apply.
 

Martin Everson

HNWI Offshore Consultant
Business Angel
Mentor Group
What we have discuss so far is to have the company in his wife name it can solve the problem here and now but if she runs everything is lost.
He doesn't trust his own wife....lol? Sounds like he got a lot bigger problems in his life :rolleyes:

Does someone here has a good idea which is possible to do and keep the bad guys away?
If he owes money to authorities and creditors isn't he the bad guy? conf/(%
 

bastard

Trusted Member
Business Angel
The money does not come from criminal activity, all legal earned.

If he owes money to authorities and creditors isn't he the bad guy? conf/(%
Yeah some people may say Im the bad guy. Anyway, the bank and the lenders were in the same boat and cheated me for my shares in my own company for years ago. It's a long and odd story not worth to explain here. It's not the key point who is the bad og good.
 

Sols

Trusted Member
Business Angel
does it change anything? would be possible to get back to the initial question?
I think my original post already answered your question.

Tax evasion, for example, is a predicate crime to money laundering in many jurisdictions. Running from creditors is also usually a crime, but circumstances can affect how severe of a crime it is.

Given that the funds appear to be of illicit origin, putting them into a Swiss company won't protect your friend from having the tax authority or creditors dissolve the company and lay claims to its assets through the courts of Switzerland.
 

bastard

Trusted Member
Business Angel
it's still legal money earned by the swiss company once it is registered.

okay, say the swiss company can't protect me. Is there any company setup anywhere that would protect him?
 

daxbr

Building Trust
Entrepreneur
it's still legal money earned by the swiss company once it is registered.

okay, say the swiss company can't protect me. Is there any company setup anywhere that would protect him?
Difficult to say not knowing where he is but generally yes for a few months. In my jurisdiction, they would charge him laudering, perverting the process and enter protective order against him possibly forever or until he funds are recovered. Can't he just withdraw cash and/or buy something expensive and portable?
 

moneyrequired

Building Trust
Entrepreneur
go to no CRS country, setup company + bank account. Never use debit or credit cards and everything will be fine.
For better sleep, if your friend have enough money, split money for 2 jurisdictions.
Another good solution for this case is setup company with addictional shareholder(s). Company created by one "burned" person could be taken by tax authorities but if company have more shareholders everything is more complicated and more safe.
 

bastard

Trusted Member
Business Angel
go to no CRS country, setup company + bank account. Never use debit or credit cards and everything will be fine.
For better sleep, if your friend have enough money, split money for 2 jurisdictions.
Another good solution for this case is setup company with addictional shareholder(s). Company created by one "burned" person could be taken by tax authorities but if company have more shareholders everything is more complicated and more safe.
This look to be good advice which I can work further with, thank you very much for this help.

Please, if there are more ideas and suggestion keep them coming I really need information as much as possible.
 

Sols

Trusted Member
Business Angel
it's still legal money earned by the swiss company once it is registered.
Let's say you have 200,000 EUR sitting in your own personal bank account and you owe 100,000 EUR to the tax man and 100,000 EUR to creditors. Instead of paying them, you transfer the money into a bank account owned by a company which you or a bunch of nominees own.

At that point, the company has 200,000 EUR in cash, which it has received through (probably) criminal activity. You haven't laundered the money yet, but you have successfully taken a step towards laundering them, immediately worsening your situation in the eyes of the law.

Instead of going after you personally, the tax man and the creditors can now instead petition Swiss courts to extract the funds from the company (the 200,000 EUR). They won't really care who owns the company in that moment. They will look at who put the money in. If the bank you hold your company funds with gets wind of this (which they usually would), they will most likely close your account.

But don't let any of this get in the way of setting up a convoluted offshore structure which, if it is pierced, risks turning your situation from just unpaid taxed and debt into unpaid taxed and debt with aggravated circumstances.
 

Artemis Eleutheria

Trusted Member
Business Angel
Does someone here has a good idea which is possible to do and keep the bad guys away?
Pay the creditors and tell the bad guys (taxman) there is no more money left. Personal bankruptcy to follow.

In most places that is not the end of the world, but will be uncomfortable for a couple of years.
 

Martin Everson

HNWI Offshore Consultant
Business Angel
Mentor Group
I don't think your gonna win long term against the government. You will want to go unbanked and all cash to survive. Best situation is to right or wrong settle those debts and just move on. You see in some places (i.e Gibraltar) transferring assets offshore and into someone elses name can still be taxed and seized. If the taxman feels you could potentially derive benefit from those transferred assets that's all it takes for them. The decision is entirely down to taxman.

In other places like UK the taxman publishes a public list of people who owe more than £25,000 (serious crime) in unpaid taxes. You can read and laugh at the people who refuse to pay some even using Dubai addresses. Hopefully your country is not like this.


Interesting is a Lithuanian fork lift driver who owes £826,000 in taxes and £495,000 in tax penalties eek¤%&.....for a fork lift driver??? HMRC is no joke this guy will be chased through EU. When I lived in UK I was for just a damn parking ticket...lol.
 

bastard

Trusted Member
Business Angel
Pay the creditors and tell the bad guys (taxman) there is no more money left. Personal bankruptcy to follow.

In most places that is not the end of the world, but will be uncomfortable for a couple of years.
It won't work that way for sure.

It looks like it need some more clarification. I understand the point with more than just him as shareholder and how it make it complicated for anyone to dissolve the company.

The point is, to register a brand new company, start a new business and the money from that goes directly into this company, so it is no illegal money, no tax evasion no nothing all clean. My friend is of course worried about (obvious) that once there is sufficient with money in the company the creditors and the tax man will come after it.
 

Artemis Eleutheria

Trusted Member
Business Angel
As long as he is personally liable for the debts he has there is really no way around personal bankruptcy to "clean the slate" in as far as I am aware. That is any one of his creditors will be able to come after any asset he ever may obtain in the future ... including his shares in your hypothetical swiss company. There being other shareholders in the company makes no difference if these are real shareholders. If they are mere nominees/trustees then they will be taken out too.
 

Hyo

New Member
Mentor Group
Very difficult to give you an actionable plan without knowing more details.But one thing is for sure:
In all jurisdictions there are loopholes to be found. The main objective for him is to become "the invisible man" for at least 3-5 years.
This means you can conduct business but NOTHING on your name, not even a debit card. It surely can be done, even without opening offshore. Good luck
 

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