Digital Nomads, Biz owners in Bangkok

[Skenners]

im having the same issue. Im an Australian Permanent Resident, but a New Zealand Citizen. Currently, I have a remote working job in Australia, so im a tax resident there, even though Im living in thailand. But im looking at day trading in the future as a full time job.

My thoughts were that I could get a company in Dubai, trade with that, but as i'd be living in Thailand, I'd have no tax residency (having given up the australian permanent residency). As long as the company in dubai has substance, I wont be taxed that money in Aus either (they tax permanent residents globally and If you try and hide behind a sham company, they'll tax you). Essentially, tax free everything and a place to live.

To me, no tax residency seems like its asking for a bunch of trouble, but I'd prefer to stay under the radar as much as possible, which leads to your two questions.
Technically, declaring no taxes at all in Thailand IS legal, but in the eyes of countries around the world If I choose to move? could prove problematic potentially.


-Skenners

 

[Puzel12]

im having the same issue. Im an Australian Permanent Resident, but a New Zealand Citizen. Currently, I have a remote working job in Australia, so im a tax resident there, even though Im living in thailand. But im looking at day trading in the future as a full time job.

My thoughts were that I could get a company in Dubai, trade with that, but as i'd be living in Thailand, I'd have no tax residency (having given up the australian permanent residency). As long as the company in dubai has substance, I wont be taxed that money in Aus either (they tax permanent residents globally and If you try and hide behind a sham company, they'll tax you). Essentially, tax free everything and a place to live.

To me, no tax residency seems like its asking for a bunch of trouble, but I'd prefer to stay under the radar as much as possible, which leads to your two questions.
Technically, declaring no taxes at all in Thailand IS legal, but in the eyes of countries around the world If I choose to move? could prove problematic potentially.


-Skenners

and even if we declare some taxes and get tax residency certificate, is there anything unsafe about this? We are doing all legally. Business outside thailand = foreign income

 

[Skenners]

and even if we declare some taxes and get tax residency certificate, is there anything unsafe about this? We are doing all legally. Business outside thailand = foreign income

from what I know, as long as you pay yourself the appropriate amount for your "job description" along with the taxes that go with it, every country should leave you alone.

Its when you start paying, like 20k for your "salary" and you're the CEO of some corporation. Looks suspicious.

-Skenners

 

[andrew28fl]

I'm thinking of getting a consultation next week with these guys Thai Elite Visa (Updated 2022) | Siam Legal International to see if they can answer my questions.

This would be super helpful to all of us..I am leaving for Phuket otherwise I would also schedule one. Might schedule one after I am back in Bangkok. I haven't been able to nail down the tax implications 100% either. I am a Canadian, and have been a non-resident of Canada for taxes for a few years now. But my business income accumulates in a single member LLC. So far, no one has questioned me. From what I am learning, people on Elite visa don't get questioned about their income, as long as you don't push the limits by opening an office, hiring staff locally etc. I would be concerned about the US questioning where I manage my LLC from at some point, especially if my income level keeps rising. Anyone else who has successfully managed a Single Member US LLC from Thailand? Especially on an Elite visa?

 

[Mike Forman]

As far as im aware, you can open normal thai currency accounts, but I dunno how many banks are multicurrency over here. They're the local banks (krungsri? bangkok bank?). Maybe setup a Wise multicurrency account and a local thai account and just transfer between them.

I'm trying to find out the tax implications myself as well as its really unclear. From what I read, with the elite visa you're just a regular resident, but not for tax purposes (i THINK. in some circumstances, you can pay tax apparently)

I'm thinking of getting a consultation next week with these guys Thai Elite Visa (Updated 2022) | Siam Legal International to see if they can answer my questions. I havent done full due diligence, but Ive seen them around for the past 10+ years, so there should be something to that as well.

-Skenners

Siam legal seems indeed one of the most reputable firms. They can help with opening of a bank account on a tourist (which is strictly speaking not allowed according to Thai law), which I plan to open next month. But for sure this account will have limitations.

Wise is not available in Thailand and I don't recommend to use an EMI any 4 digit amounts for personal accounts.

Would be great if you could share any useful insights you obtained from Siam legal!

 

[Puzel12]

Siam legal seems indeed one of the most reputable firms. They can help with opening of a bank account on a tourist (which is strictly speaking not allowed according to Thai law), which I plan to open next month. But for sure this account will have limitations.

Wise is not available in Thailand and I don't recommend to use an EMI any 4 digit amounts for personal accounts.

Would be great if you could share any useful insights you obtained from Siam legal!

I am Thai Tax resident and I have wise on my thai details Why it's not available?

 

[JackAlabama]

What is the easiest setup in Thailand to get a non-tourist visa (elite visa is a vip tourist visa, so seems not that very interesting as well).

I believe it's to start a business and get a work permit. Any easy / cheap feasible setup that would make this an easy set up?

Can you open easily multi currency bank accounts in Thailand once you got some residence visa and is movement of money easy? Can you easily withdraw for example USD if you have a USD account?

The business route is a s*fest of its best. It can, however, be made working. Be prepared to have an intimate relashionship with your lawyer who assists you in doing it and pray for it to run smoothly. Cost is somewhat ok-ish for having a fully fledged Thai business which is horrible from a bureaucrazy point of view.
It did not follow thru with it however, but I had all blueprints ready some years ago.

This would be super helpful to all of us..I am leaving for Phuket otherwise I would also schedule one. Might schedule one after I am back in Bangkok. I haven't been able to nail down the tax implications 100% either. I am a Canadian, and have been a non-resident of Canada for taxes for a few years now. But my business income accumulates in a single member LLC. So far, no one has questioned me. From what I am learning, people on Elite visa don't get questioned about their income, as long as you don't push the limits by opening an office, hiring staff locally etc. I would be concerned about the US questioning where I manage my LLC from at some point, especially if my income level keeps rising. Anyone else who has successfully managed a Single Member US LLC from Thailand? Especially on an Elite visa?

You would need to declare where you manage your US LLC from on form 5472?

 

[Skenners]

I am Thai Tax resident and I have wise on my thai details Why it's not available?

How did you get Tax Residency? and for what reason? (if you dont mind me asking, that is)

I also Use Wise and for 4 digit amounts too. I spent 5k AUD (120k thb) on getting a 6 month apartment contract and it took 2 days to process. I DID have to talk to my australian bank to say that it wasnt a scam and it was legit processing, but other than that was relatively smooth sailing.

I also use Wise to pay my rent every month as well (40k thb ~1700 AUD).

@Mike Forman is there any reason why you wouldnt use an EMI?

-Skenners

 

[Mercury]

"A tax resident is a foreigner spending a minimum of 180 days in Thailand during any tax year."

 

[Skenners]

If thats the case, then an elite visa and staying 180+ days in thailand will cover tax residency issues, while paying 0% income tax on foreign sourced income.

In my case, I'd offshore a company and trade with that (in say, dubai or something), and hire and pay myself a salary. For my own reasons (Just in case), I'd put tax money aside, but as i'd be getting a salary outside of thailand, i shouldnt be getting any tax issues from thailand on the elite visa. Hrmm... might be worth it afterall.

In the 10+ years ive seen the elite visa, Ive never known the government to change the details to look at where the income comes from, so i dont think they'd change it anytime soon. Cool Beans.

-Skenners

 

[andrew28fl]

You would need to declare where you manage your US LLC from on form 5472?

Yes. I have read from multiple people who have said that Thailand doesn't concern itself with taxing such individuals though, is that not the case? Technically, I think on an elite visa, you can't work from Thailand. So can you even file taxes in Thailand? From my understanding so far, if you don't remit income within the same year, it would be tax free.

 

[Mike Forman]

I am Thai Tax resident and I have wise on my thai details Why it's not available?

You have wise multi currency bank accounts, meaning you can actually receive and save EUR, USD on your account?

I know wise business is not available in Thailand and I assumed a Thai Wise account is just as a wise Hong Kong business account, you can exchange and send money but don't have multi currency bank accounts as in Europe.

How did you get Tax Residency? and for what reason? (if you dont mind me asking, that is)

I also Use Wise and for 4 digit amounts too. I spent 5k AUD (120k thb) on getting a 6 month apartment contract and it took 2 days to process. I DID have to talk to my australian bank to say that it wasnt a scam and it was legit processing, but other than that was relatively smooth sailing.

I also use Wise to pay my rent every month as well (40k thb ~1700 AUD).

@Mike Forman is there any reason why you wouldnt use an EMI?

-Skenners

I mean not more than 5 digits, so I wouldn't save 200k usd on wise, 50k usd is no problem.

My experiences with wise have been all good and we have used it for 5 digit business transfers. Just as with other EMI they can easily block your funds and although Wise their support is quite ok, that might not always be like this. There have been too many stories around of EMI, a physical bank you can always pay a visit.

Finally you will always need a local bank account in my opinion, at least if you want to move some money around or investment.

For monthly / daily expenses such as rent, travel expenses and other expenses wise is perfect.

With Hong Kong or Singapore Bank personal accounts you can easily move around a few 100k usd at once, without any questions asked. I haven't tried that with wise and also will not try

 

[Skenners]

ah k. Would a HSBC multicurrency account work for you then? HSBC are a bit.. dodgey with some stuff, but are global, can handle large amounts, do business accounts and have physical banks in most countries around the world

-Skenners

 

[Mike Forman]

ah k. Would a HSBC multicurrency account work for you then? HSBC are a bit.. dodgey with some stuff, but are global, can handle large amounts, do business accounts and have physical banks in most countries around the world

-Skenners

HSBC is tricky.. Used them for business accounts before, wouldn't use them for personal accounts.

Seems we don't have any clear answers yet:

1) with an elite visa can you easily open regular local bank accounts?

2) are you considered a resident with an elite visa and will there be any CRS reporting abroad? As some had stated you are a tax resident if you stay in Thailand over 6 months. Does that change anything for CRS reporting (in don't believe banks ask for tax certificates)
Do banks ask you on account opening where your permanent address is or they just record your Thai address and report it locally

3) is it possible to open a multi currency (usd, eur,..) bank account in Thailand with a local bank (not HSBC, citi,..). Can you get dual currency atm/credit cards?

4) is it possible to open a true money e wallet account with an elite visa? From what I've read a work permit is asked.

5) what are the legal tax implications if you transfer monthly some money to Thailand or if you transfer a lump sum from your personal savings (e.g. 300k usd). Government perhaps doesn't care yet, but with the crs reporting they will have more insights in your accounts

 

[Skenners]

Do you think Siam Legal would be able to answer those? or a proper international/thai tax agent would?

If I go ahead with the elite visa, ill be asking those questions before I do, regardless.

-Skenners

 

[Skenners]

Ok, So ive shot an email to Siam Legal about getting an Elite Visa. Ill do some shopping around as well to see if I can find other places that can answer @Mike Forman 's questions above.

Also, with Wise, I've just seen their limitations. I moved over 600k thb for the visa (26k Aud) to my personal wise account and it said that I hit the "free" limit of 530k thb. I ended up moving 100k thb (about 5k aud) to my aud account there just so it wouldnt incurr fees. costing me another 20 bux or so in transfer and conversion fees. Bunch of pr*cks.

Wise is fine if you're using it as a day to day transfer or a low once off bulk transfer between accounts, but you guys are right when it comes to larger transfer 5+ digits longer. Stuff that noise.

-Skenners

 

[Skenners]

This might be helpful for some of you looking for structure.

-Skenners

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

Ok, So ive shot an email to Siam Legal about getting an Elite Visa. Ill do some shopping around as well to see if I can find other places that can answer @Mike Forman 's questions above.

Also, with Wise, I've just seen their limitations. I moved over 600k thb for the visa (26k Aud) to my personal wise account and it said that I hit the "free" limit of 530k thb. I ended up moving 100k thb (about 5k aud) to my aud account there just so it wouldnt incurr fees. costing me another 20 bux or so in transfer and conversion fees. Bunch of pr*cks.

Wise is fine if you're using it as a day to day transfer or a low once off bulk transfer between accounts, but you guys are right when it comes to larger transfer 5+ digits longer. Stuff that noise.

-Skenners

deemoney is great for large transfers

 

[Skenners]

deemoney

thanks! Im only pushing money INTO thailand at the moment. Going to look at getting the thai elite visa, then waiting out the year using my offshore accounts to convert smaller amounts until I can start moving money to thailand tax free. Until then, ill just have to use less money in each transfers (under 25k). I cant see myself transferring that much money again for a while.

-Skenners

 

[BlinkHood]

Ok, So ive shot an email to Siam Legal about getting an Elite Visa. Ill do some shopping around as well to see if I can find other places that can answer @Mike Forman 's questions above.

Also, with Wise, I've just seen their limitations. I moved over 600k thb for the visa (26k Aud) to my personal wise account and it said that I hit the "free" limit of 530k thb. I ended up moving 100k thb (about 5k aud) to my aud account there just so it wouldnt incurr fees. costing me another 20 bux or so in transfer and conversion fees. Bunch of pr*cks.

Wise is fine if you're using it as a day to day transfer or a low once off bulk transfer between accounts, but you guys are right when it comes to larger transfer 5+ digits longer. Stuff that noise.

-Skenners

Nice, whenever you have the answer be sure to update!

It looks like we're looking for something similar: I've been making money trading/investing for the past few years and looking to move somewhere low tax/tax free. I looked into the elite visa a few months ago and I had the same doubts: given that it's a glorified tourist visa can you get tax residency?
Is it perfectly legal to not pay taxes there or is it simply something that I can get away with? I would like for my structure to be completely legal and not something that simply wont be enforced.

I was also looking at Philippines which has a very similar taxation system.