How do VCC sites issue cards from big banks?

[float]

I'm having trouble understanding how sites like vcc.is and cardvcc.com (maybe ezzocard too, I haven't checked their BINs) manage to issue cards from massive banks in the USA.

How do they do it? They are obviously not stolen because they are issued to the name and address I provide.

Thanks for the help in advance!!

 

[Sols]

They either have agreements with banks/issuers or agreements with other companies that have agreements with banks/issuers.

It's usually called BIN sponsorship.

 

[float]

They either have agreements with banks/issuers or agreements with other companies that have agreements with banks/issuers.

It's usually called BIN sponsorship.

How are these services even legal? What countries do these services set up in?
How is an American bank okay with issuing cards for an offshore dodgy business that issues cards for people without ID for crypto?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm quite confused and I'm very interested in this.

 

[wellington]

How are these services even legal? What countries do these services set up in?
How is an American bank okay with issuing cards for an offshore dodgy business that issues cards for people without ID for crypto?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm quite confused and I'm very interested in this.

Most of these cards have onchain AML, offchain AML and KYC

Only low loads cards (disposable/one time use) <300$ don’t from what I’ve seen and as per the law you don’t have to KyC for cash transaction for such a low value so why would it be different for crypto?

 

[float]

Most of these cards have onchain AML, offchain AML and KYC

Only low loads cards (disposable/one time use) <300$ don’t from what I’ve seen and as per the law you don’t have to KyC for cash transaction for such a low value so why would it be different for crypto?

Sorry, this post makes zero sense to me. Could you please explain in a bit more detail?

 

[wellington]

Sorry, this post makes zero sense to me. Could you please explain in a bit more detail?

I just did

There’s VCC and CC

cC require KyC
VCC do and don’t depends on one time use and value or multi time use

There’s no VCC that I am aware of that you can load up thousands without Kyc and aml

 

[ilke]

Sorry, this post makes zero sense to me. Could you please explain in a bit more detail?

The US (which you discussed) doesn't require there to be KYC done on prepaid cards below a fixed value. IIRC, it is $1,000. In Hong Kong, for example, it's HK$3,000.

The banks can charge an issuing/top-up fee on the cards. They have hardly any associated costs because of there not being a need for KYC or proper AML in this scenario. The platforms you refer to give the bank cash and then deal with the crypto you pay in on their own.

How are these services even legal?

There is nothing wrong with card issuing, which part of the service do you refer to?

What countries do these services set up in?

If you mean the card selling platforms, usually BVI or the Marshall Islands are popular choices. They often also have a seemingly unconnected US/EU entity that actually joins the programmes. I remember that Capitalist was using a Hungarian Kft. at some point.

How is an American bank okay with issuing cards for an offshore dodgy business that issues cards for people without ID for crypto?

Because they have nothing to lose in that case.

 

[float]

Thank you @ilke for the very valuable information!

I just checked my CardVCC account, and I am able to reload one of my cards with more funds. I don't actually know if I can load more than $1,000 onto the card at once as I don't have that amount in my balance right now. If CardVCC never let me have more than $1,000 at a time it would all stay legal? Seems like an easy loophole.

I just did another google and it seems like "Laso Finance" allows you to create a card with more than a $1,000 balance.

 

[EliasIT]

I just did another google and it seems like "Laso Finance" allows you to create a card with more than a $1,000 balance.

only one card per customer or more?

 

[float]

only one card per customer or more?

What are you asking? I don't understand.

@ilke

On the FinCEN.gov website (Final Rule – Definitions and Other Regulations Relating to Prepaid Access | FinCEN.gov).

Referring to point 11:

Reloadable Temporary Prepaid Access Devices: These are prepaid cards or similar devices that can be reloaded with funds but are intended for temporary use.

Exclusion Criteria:

• Value Limit: The device’s maximum value, use, or withdrawal limit must be less than $1,000 on any day.
• International Use: The device cannot be used internationally.
• Reload Source: The device cannot be reloaded from non-depository sources (e.g., third-party cash reload services).
• Transferability: The device cannot be used to transfer value among users.

What does not make sense to me is that both Laso.Finance and CardVCC break these rules and should be collecting KYC details. Why aren't they?

- Laso.Finance allows $1,000+ per day transactions (Check their Twitter, people are reporting iPhone purchases etc above $1,000 USD)
- CardVCC allows international transactions and possibly card values over $1,000

 

[ilke]

@ilke

On the FinCEN.gov website (Final Rule – Definitions and Other Regulations Relating to Prepaid Access | FinCEN.gov).

Referring to point 11:

Reloadable Temporary Prepaid Access Devices: These are prepaid cards or similar devices that can be reloaded with funds but are intended for temporary use.

Exclusion Criteria:

• Value Limit: The device’s maximum value, use, or withdrawal limit must be less than $1,000 on any day.
• International Use: The device cannot be used internationally.
• Reload Source: The device cannot be reloaded from non-depository sources (e.g., third-party cash reload services).
• Transferability: The device cannot be used to transfer value among users.

What does not make sense to me is that both Laso.Finance and CardVCC break these rules and should be collecting KYC details. Why aren't they?

- Laso.Finance allows $1,000+ per day transactions (Check their Twitter, people are reporting iPhone purchases etc above $1,000 USD)
- CardVCC allows international transactions and possibly card values over $1,000

I see, yes, that's the document I was referring to.

In theory, these companies are not completely legal in the first place. First of all, they hold client funds without a respective license to do so. BVI and the Caymans are starting to crack down more on unregulated offshore business (that should be). The Marshalls haven't made such a step yet. Second, they will probably be running these from other places. They should be getting licensed in those places, and paying taxes there (if either are applicable) which they're likely not to do.

How they make the banks work with this - hard to tell. Since they issue the cards in the name you choose, it has to be a BaaS or bin-sponsorship as we discussed. Wirecard US was issuing prepaid cards up to $150K with no KYC a couple years back (before its collapse obviously). I assume that there must be some kind of loophole to this whereby this law does not apply (i.e. 1 requirement is not met).

 

[float]

@ilke Thank you very very much. You've been super helpful. If there was some way I could award you for more reputation points I would!!

 

[EliasIT]

very good thread.

What are you asking? I don't understand.

I got my answer already. Was wondering if it was possible to have more than 1 card per customer!