OnlyFans competitor with crypto payment

[jesuschrist]

Greetings, what is the best setup for an OnlyFans like site with an associated token?

Almost everything is ready for that, I wrote most of the codebase in Node.js and React.js, with the help of a few others.
It's a centralized website, not a dapp, although there will be some web3 stuff.
I will personally put 100k $ in this project, if required maybe more, but I know that won't be enough so I'm also looking for investors.

The token is designed as a discount token to be used on the website, it won't have an initial public sale, just private sale and than later on the secondary markets and LPs.

How it will differ from other sites:
The main focus is on content creators who live in banned jurisdictions. (Philippines, Kazakhstan, RU)
These countries has abundance of models, I have contacts with many of them already, with the necessary incentives they will advertise their profiles on their IGs and TikToks.
Many of these models has 200-300k of real followers yet advertising with them is cheap.
To acquire paying customers we will also do organic marketing in crypto communities, like reddit.

Payment methods:
Focus is on crypto payments, users can deposit a wide variety of crypto, with our token they can get discounts.
But I know a large percent of users won't want to deposit crypto, so with MoonPay they can also use credit cards.
Only content creators can withdraw crypto, all of them will be KYCd, for some countries we will plan to setup local payment options, like Gcash in the Philippines.

The site will be safer than most crypto exchanges as there are much less attack vectors, the deposits will quickly go into cold storage, and the withdrawals will happen less frequently.

Risks:
I had many successful and some failed projects, so I have no illusions, it is possible the website will never take off, but I will do everything to make this work.
The potential profit can be enermous, with more investors we can share the initial risks.
The server costs will be minimal, I plan to spend the majority of the budget on marketing, smaller part of it on exchange listings and for liquidity.

Profits:
We will have multiple revenue streams, from the fees on the website, from the token sales, fees from the liquidity pools, and from market making on exchanges.
The plan is to list the token on Tier 2 exchanges, that has real volume yet the listing fee is much less than on a Tier 1 exchange.

I would keep it semi-private and have less than 10 large private investors.
I'm looking for 1m $ for 50% of equity + token options with vesting.

• I am an EU national, EU resident, EU tax resident. (Hungary)
• I spend most of the year in Asia on tourist visa, the most is in Thailand.
• I made low 7 figures with crypto investments, all legal, everything that I cashed out I paid 15% flat income tax after.
• I can prove and sign messages from old ETH addresses, some of my trades were so profitable that those are watched by bots and 1000s of people who would buy the same tokens I'm buying there.

I'm ready to change my residency to most places, though I prefer the tropics, I was thinking about Thailand but looks like that won't work based on the latest rumors.
Don't recommend Dubai please, I don't like that place.

Below a certain amount I'm okay paying the 15% income tax because you know, Give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar.
The good thing about my country is that neither the government nor the banks care about crypto, you can cash out any amount, no questions asked.
But I'm not sure how strict they are about the adult industry, that is why I would prefer going with an offshore company.

The bad thing about my government is that they take CFC very very seriously.
I know it would be still considered a Hungarian tax resident company and subject to the 9% corporation tax, but I think I have options there.
For example instead of taking out the profits the company could do token buy backs from the private investors equally.

Should I setup different entities, one for the website and one for the token issuance?
What would be the best jurisdiction for this project if I would want to keep my tax residency? And if I would change it?

PS: Sorry for the profile, I assure you this project is serious.

 

[JohnnyDoe]

I'm looking for 1m $ for 50% of equity + token options with vesting.

On what basis do you value your company (if it exists - otherwise it’s just a code and an idea) $2m?

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

Payment methods:
Focus is on crypto payments, users can deposit a wide variety of crypto, with our token they can get discounts.
But I know a large percent of users won't want to deposit crypto, so with MoonPay they can also use credit cards.
Only content creators can withdraw crypto, all of them will be KYCd, for some countries we will plan to setup local payment options, like Gcash in the Philippines.

The site will be safer than most crypto exchanges as there are much less attack vectors, the deposits will quickly go into cold storage, and the withdrawals will happen less frequently.

Contact Binance for this, they'll help you set this up nicely for a decent price, and their security is top notch.
My two cents.

Great idea btw

Don't recommend Dubai please, I don't like that place.

You'll be left alone for the most part in PH (not that theres any rule excepting you from taxation, but rather little enforcement).
Cambodia same, Laos too but Laos is very poor so infrastructure sucks.

Not entirely sure how this TH thing will work out in the end, TH is very mismanaged so fingers crossed we can slide through the cracks.

 

[Sols]

How do you ensure that models are consenting adults and neither minors nor coerced? What's your identity and content verification policy?

What steps do you take to prevent money laundering and sanctions evasion being done via your platform?

Just collecting KYC isn't the same as having proper procedures in place.

If you can remove Russia from the list of target countries, your business becomes a lot more viable. Pretty much all the good fiat-crypto on/off ramps (like Moonpay) are based in EU/EEA, UK, or US, and they will kick you out if you're facilitating money transfers to/from Russia (and other similarly sanctioned countries). Philippines and Kazakhstan are fine.

Should I setup different entities, one for the website and one for the token issuance?

Probably, yes. Businesses like these are often set up as separate entities.

What would be the best jurisdiction for this project if I would want to keep my tax residency? And if I would change it?

I am an EU national, EU resident, EU tax resident. (Hungary)

Hungary taxes citizens regardless of residence. You can take steps to reduce the corporate tax burden, though, but your personal taxes are due in Hungary unless there is a tax treaty and/or unless you commit tax fraud.

 

[jesuschrist]

On what basis do you value your company (if it exists - otherwise it’s just a code and an idea) $2m?

True just code which is very lightweight and efficient, if it becomes something it will be easy to extend in the future and for new team members to join it.
I worked on exchange engines, on projects that performed well under hundreds of thousands of concurrent users.

I know laymen don't value code, for them every codebase is the same as long as it has a working UI, in some ways I agree with it, a website without users is useless, but there is a big difference between code and code.
I've seen people spending a fortune on codes written by Indians and Ukrainians and when it stopped working after 20 concurrent users they were so shocked, after they had to rewrite the whole thing with in-house developers.

Try to hire some development team to make this software for you, 99% you will encounter some very big issue, like half of your transactions will be rerouted to a different address only because a developer wanted to finish the site quickly and decided to use a 3rd party module without checking if its really safe or not.

To answer your question, like all early valuations it's just an arbitrary number, I think $1m is required for the start but I also want to lower my risk and not locking most of my capital
for this, but I also wish to retain 50% equity.

If you have a different offer PM me.

Contact Binance for this, they'll help you set this up nicely for a decent price, and their security is top notch.
My two cents.

Great idea btw

Thank you!

Do you mean Binance Pay?
Can users pay directly with crypto with that solution, or are they required to have a Binance account to pay?

You'll be left alone for the most part in PH (not that theres any rule excepting you from taxation, but rather little enforcement).
Cambodia same, Laos too but Laos is very poor so infrastructure sucks.

Not entirely sure how this TH thing will work out in the end, TH is very mismanaged so fingers crossed we can slide through the cracks.

Sadly my country is kinda different than other EU countries, they require DTA and very strong proofs if you claim you will be resident somewhere else, I was thinking about PH too but I don't think that would work, and well there are better places to live in.

I heard locals in TH talking about the tax changes so I'm not sure about that, but hopefully.

 

[JohnnyDoe]

Can you substantiate the value of the code in an objective way?
If you contribute $100k, with $1m I want 90% equity. Otherwise I would just be financing your new tropical residence.

 

[jesuschrist]

How do you ensure that models are consenting adults and neither minors nor coerced? What's your identity and content verification policy?

On top of the necessary ID, and selfie checks to prevent minors, there will be also Social Media profile and other checks to ensure the content creators are all consenting adults. The number of content creators usually much less than the normal users, so it should be possible to review if their SM profile are genuine, and keep checking them regularly.

If you can remove Russia from the list of target countries

For Russians there won't be any fiat payment option, only crypto. And there will be sanction list and chain analysis checks.
For the other countries the AML checks should be done by the fiat onramp providers.

Do you think it's okay to allow Russian citizen models who aren't residents of Russia anymore?

Hungary taxes citizens regardless of residence.

Hungary is still not the USA. In some ways you are right, non-resident citizens still pay income tax, but there is an exemption, that there is DTA with your new residency country and you properly change your residency and renounce your Address ID card.

Can you substantiate the value of the code in an objective way?

1. You pay $500k and the developers finish the code in 1-2 years, in case of exponential user growth you will have to add $100-$1000 to the monthly server costs.

2. You pay $50k and the developers finish the code in 2 months, but every new month there is +5% chance it will be hacked and you will bear substantial loses, if the user growth is exponential you will have to add $10k-$20k to the monthly servers costs but after a few months it will suddenly stop working anyway, so you can decide to either shutdown the site or do option 1.

If you contribute $100k, with $1m I want 90% equity. Otherwise I would just be financing your new tropical residence.

It's not just 50% equity for $1m, but also token options, which can compensate the less equity.
In the best case scenario it is possible you can be in profit a few months after launch, in a regular startup you can't sell your equity for years.

 

[JohnnyDoe]

1. You pay $500k and the developers finish the code in 1-2 years, in case of exponential user growth you will have to add $100-$1000 to the monthly server costs.

2. You pay $50k and the developers finish the code in 2 months, but every new month there is +5% chance it will be hacked and you will bear substantial loses, if the user growth is exponential you will have to add $10k-$20k to the monthly servers costs but after a few months it will suddenly stop working anyway, so you can decide to either shutdown the site or do option 1.

do you have invoices showing what you actually paid? Or the hours of work you needed if you created the code yourself?

token options

They are worth zero because the token is worth zero.

Sorry but investors don't buy dreams.

 

[jesuschrist]

do you have invoices showing what you actually paid? Or the hours of work you needed if you created the code yourself?

Code is like an art, do you also ask the painter to collect all the invoices showing how much he paid for the paints, how many hours he spent working on it, and then value the painting based on that?

Investors who are seriously interested will receive access to it, and they can decide it's value.

Sorry but investors don't buy dreams.

It's a very high risk, very high reward project, I understand it's not for everyone.

 

[BalnearioCamboriu]

(Philippines, Kazakhstan, RU)

You've used the full names of the first 2 countries, and a country code for Russia?!!

What a boring topic this is!

 

[jesuschrist]

You've used the full names of the first 2 countries, and a country code for Russia?!!

What a boring topic this is!

Sorry if it was difficult to understand, and sorry if I'm not entertaining you.

 

[polonieth]

I have seen a few adult related tokens, don't think any have taken off?

Nafty was one, had a few OF girls behind it, I can't even find it now.

 

[manukahoney]

Never will work.
Most of weebs who pay for OF are too lazy to get hold on crypto, they only have credit cards (often in their parents name). You are targeting like 1-5% of the potential demand side.

Top OF girls from sanctioned jurisdictions already solved the payment problems (using proxies and "agencies"), so you again targeting the lower bracket of supply with low levels of potential "donors". On OF the Pareto principle is exaggerated, 5% of actors get like 95% of revenue.

So your potential market size is around 0.05*0.05 = 0.25% of what OF is ($6 bln turnover), which is about $15 million of turnover annually. With 30% take you will have $4.5 million revenue, barely enough to pay for servers, developers and potential litigation costs.

 

[Sols]

For the other countries the AML checks should be done by the fiat onramp providers.

I've seen people use this exact argument before. Regulators don't accept it. Not clear if you would be in scope for the same regulations as a financial service provider. But by holding and distributing money, the risk is there. Highly dependent on where you set up shop.

Do you think it's okay to allow Russian citizen models who aren't residents of Russia anymore?

Generally speaking, yes, that's fine provided they can show residence permit in a non-sanctioned territory. Check what the sanctions regulations are in your country of operation and country of incorporation. There are some weird special limits and regulations here and there.

 

[JackAlabama]

Code is like an art, do you also ask the painter to collect all the invoices showing how much he paid for the paints, how many hours he spent working on it, and then value the painting based on that?

Investors who are seriously interested will receive access to it, and they can decide it's value.


It's a very high risk, very high reward project, I understand it's not for everyone.

Code of such a project (a clear scope, its onlyfans, has been invented already) is not art, its engineering.
Theres many args for this for example theres no comp science class titled code like artist, code like picasso and such. Instead, its called software engineering etc. and all methods used resemble the construction of a car.
Should such a code having been engineered like art, its best to value it at 0.
The venture is also not an nft thing where the painting metaphor can be applied (with a lot of goodwill).

Token is not needed and adds reg risk only since its an unregistered security used for extracting value from naive users buying a worthless token and serving as hidden funding mechanism (which is common and used by crypto foundations). The times for this are bad since regulators are coming for this.

Whats the exact value prop of an only fans copy? Just adding crypto but then still doing kyc? Its either full yolo game on reg arb or not.

Valuation is very high. 10x asking price for the same founder equity stake is too much for a 0 traction project and unclear value prop.
50% for 150k would look way more reasonable leaving 50k for coding works of 1 years worth of labour.

Or 40% for 100k leaving 20% unallocated for future vc funding.

 

[jafo]

Can you show a working site?

Why only naked girls? How about a subscription platform for other things?

 

[jesuschrist]

I have seen a few adult related tokens, don't think any have taken off?

Yes there were many clones, almost all were scams or ghost towns with a few models only, they just launched and waited, they didn't even try to fake it till you make it.

they only have credit cards

I'm aware of it, that is why the use of fiat onramps, where users can use their credit cards to buy crypto which gets transferred to the platform right away, so the platform doesn't touch fiat.

potential market size is around 0.05*0.05 = 0.25% of what OF is ($6 bln turnover), which is about $15 million of turnover annually.

Maybe I'm wrong but I believe the potential market size is much bigger, if OF had crypto payments, good competitors or not so many restricted countries I would probably have never started it.

I've seen people use this exact argument before. Regulators don't accept it. Not clear if you would be in scope for the same regulations as a financial service provider.

For example there are much less regulations for crypto-crypto exchanges than for fiat-crypto exchanges. I believe for a site like this even less.
But you are right, I will have to research more on this subject.

is not art, its engineering

So you say artists don't work on cars, on mobile phones, on laptops, only engineers?
My point was it's very difficult to value code, sure if it's a terrible software it's usually pretty obvious, but giving absolute valuation to a good codebase is difficult, most people just value it relative compared to other similar good codebases.

Token is not needed and adds reg risk

As far as I know regulators are only after either full scams or US projects.

50% for 150k would look way more reasonable

Thank you for your input, but I don't think I could do the marketing, listings and token liquidity with that low investment.

Can you show a working site?

Why only naked girls? How about a subscription platform for other things?

Of course, a few weeks more and I can invite you to the private beta, if you interested.

Great idea thank you, I will start with naked girls but if the site won't get enough traction why not.
Actually I was thinking about a private forum or community for crypto users.

 

[manukahoney]

Maybe I'm wrong but I believe the potential market size is much bigger, if OF had crypto payments, good competitors or not so many restricted countries I would probably have never started it.

This is exactly where most of p2p crypto projects find their doom. Crypto is ridiculously difficult to handle when we talk small, daily transactions. You need to get a wallet, keep the seed safe, keep your phone safe, the fees are ridiculous and only few places actually accept it.
Yes, I'm familiar with Lightning network, it's non-existent IRL. So the only real token for payment is a Tron USDT, which is glitchy as hell and you still will have to buy it first somewhere.
Imagine trying to buy a $10 6-pack in rural USA with SEPA EUR transfer. That is how alien this feels to an average Joe and I assume this is why OF has not integrated crypto pay-ins/pay-outs. Their users want a quick wank, not a 3 hours deep dive in crypto.

 

[jafo]

Their users want a quick wank

This literally made me ROTFLMAO!

Of course, a few weeks more and I can invite you to the private beta, if you interested.

Done! Count me in. To be direct & upfront, I don't want ANY operational responsibilities. My goal is to be a shareholder just like I am currently in $AAPL, $MSFT, $BRKA, $MRNA etc etc.

Great idea thank you, I will start with naked girls but if the site won't get enough traction why not.
Actually I was thinking about a private forum or community for crypto users.

I have "some" experience with this type of stuff as I currently invest some of my disposable income (crypto only - NOT Fiat) in "the secondary market or marketplaces for accessing Pre-IPO equity. I use several online marketplaces for trading pre-IPO employee shares from privately held companies. The platforms often link employees from private companies with investors who would not otherwise be able to invest in the company prior to an IPO."

One particular investment site "focuses on developing and commercializing financial technology based on cryptographically-secured, decentralized ledgers, etc etc…"

Adhering to forum rules, I'd rather NOT disclose these sites to avoid running afoul of the OCT advertising rules.

 

[jesuschrist]

Their users want a quick wank, not a 3 hours deep dive in crypto.

Using credit card fiat onramps is not too different compared to the traditional credit card processing.
And people who pay with crypto usually choose larger packages to save on fees.
So those average Joes will stop after their first $5 sub, while crypto users will probably deposit $100 at once and waste it just to save a few $ on fees.