Statue of limitation - USA

[pixbix]

Wire fraud . ATM fraud, bank fraud, trading crypto to 3d party is punishable by up to 20 years in prison, and can result in a fine of up to $250,000. but statue of limitation for wire fraud is only 5 years in US?

Can someone explain this to me? So it's better if they won't find you in 5 years? Also in case the prosecutor know at your door after 4 years 11 months, they will send you the trial ,so you will still be in a trial when 5 years passed, will the case be dismissed then ?

 

[JohnnyDoe]

Wire fraud . ATM fraud, bank fraud, trading crypto to 3d party is punishable by up to 20 years in prison, and can result in a fine of up to $250,000. but statue of limitation for wire fraud is only 5 years in US?

Can someone explain this to me? So it's better if they won't find you in 5 years? Also in case the prosecutor know at your door after 4 years 11 months, they will send you the trial ,so you will still be in a trial when 5 years passed, will the case be dismissed then ?

It’s ten years if the offense concerns a financial institution, so about always.
Anyway, if you are at the stage where you are thinking about a defense, it is better you hire a good ($500+/hr) lawyer and discuss with him.

 

[pixbix]

I am not. I just wanted to know.

 

[JohnnyDoe]

I am not. I just wanted to know.

Better to plan the fraud in another country. Or at least donate some money to the dems.

 

[reallyawesome1111]

> in case the prosecutor know at your door after 4 years 11 months, they will send you the trial ,so you will still be in a trial when 5 years passed, will the case be dismissed then ?

No. 5 year statute of limitations means they have 5 years to initiate prosecution. Charges will not go away if they have already started. You can also be indicted under seal, visit America 20 years later and still go to jail.

> trading crypto to 3d party

This is not illegal unless you don't register ("unlicensed money transmitter") and still is only punishable by up to 5 years.

"ATM fraud" is not a crime in the US and would probably either be bank or wire fraud depending on what they want to charge you with.

Also, just so you know, deciding what kind of crime to get into by looking at the sentences is exactly the kind of thing that would be noted by the government at sentencing and would probably result in the judge giving you a higher sentence because it suggests your crime was highly premeditated. And no one is getting 20 years for wire fraud unless they had a large victim count and large amount of victims suffering hardship or they stole from homeless orphans or something. See Sentencing Guidelines Calculator -- Sentencing.us - $5,000,000 wire fraud with 3 victims and no previous criminal history is 37-46 months with acceptance of responsibility.

 

[pixbix]

yeah, but for crypto trading using paypal, they might add more things, like money laundering (out of their a*s) , if the accounts were fake, ... also another things, if you bought some virtual bank accounts to verify the accounts others things...and so on ... no?

I am not in this situation , I was just reading how the LAW in US works and i was amazed, how they have a 5 year time limit to prosecute you , after that...by by ... but if they catch you in those 5 years they can give you 20-30 years.

I was looking at this video so you can understand what i mean :

 

[reallyawesome1111]

yeah, but for crypto trading using paypal, they might add more things, like money laundering (out of their a*s) , if the accounts were fake, ... also another things, if you bought some virtual bank accounts to verify the accounts others things...and so on ... no?

I am not in this situation , I was just reading how the LAW in US works and i was amazed, how they have a 5 year time limit to prosecute you , after that...by by ... but if they catch you in those 5 years they can give you 20-30 years.

I was looking at this video so you can understand what i mean :

> yeah, but for crypto trading using paypal, they might add more things, like money laundering (out of their a*s) , if the accounts were fake, ...

If you receive proceeds that are described to you as criminal or that they can prove you "should have known" were criminal you can be guilty of money laundering. Undercovers routinely do Paxful/Localbitcoins/etc trades, tell exchangers that their money is from a crime, get the exchanger to complete the transaction anyways and then arrest them for money laundering.

> also another things, if you bought some virtual bank accounts to verify the accounts others things...and so on ... no?

There is a new trend of charging people who use nominee accounts to get around bank/payment processor restrictions with bank fraud (I think it's bullshit but basically they argue that lying about the owner of the account can result in the bank taking on risks it otherwise would not have taken and judges generally go along with it). There is a case just filed against people in nutraceuticals charging them with wire fraud and bank fraud not for cheating their customers but for lying on payment processor applications (https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.utd.136291/gov.uscourts.utd.136291.1.0.pdf). There was no actual loss to anyone, yet apparently there is a crime. America is not the place for this kind of thing. See Binance's multi billion dollar efforts to escape America's jurisdiction.

 

[pixbix]

> yeah, but for crypto trading using paypal, they might add more things, like money laundering (out of their a*s) , if the accounts were fake, ...

If you receive proceeds that are described to you as criminal or that they can prove you "should have known" were criminal you can be guilty of money laundering. Undercovers routinely do Paxful/Localbitcoins/etc trades, tell exchangers that their money is from a crime, get the exchanger to complete the transaction anyways and then arrest them for money laundering.

> also another things, if you bought some virtual bank accounts to verify the accounts others things...and so on ... no?

There is a new trend of charging people who use nominee accounts to get around bank/payment processor restrictions with bank fraud (I think it's bullshit but basically they argue that lying about the owner of the account can result in the bank taking on risks it otherwise would not have taken and judges generally go along with it). There is a case just filed against people in nutraceuticals charging them with wire fraud and bank fraud not for cheating their customers but for lying on payment processor applications (https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.utd.136291/gov.uscourts.utd.136291.1.0.pdf). There was no actual loss to anyone, yet apparently there is a crime. America is not the place for this kind of thing. See Binance's multi billion dollar efforts to escape America's jurisdiction.

My problem is that I had an internet advertising business, so i moved a lot of money, i also kept them in crypto , because those payments processors could always steal 50 000$ from you , and tell you to go to file a police case against them if you want your money back , so police will investigate yourself for being a honest guy... or all kind of craps. Long time ago one company told me because i am from Est europe they want to take my 75 000$ and to pay themself the 35 000$ some russians guy stolen from them, even if i was not russian , i was romanian !!! they were thinking it's fair! I wanted to put all my money in safe business, not perfect money, e-gold, (now defunct) , or some EMIs. I want to invest them in stocks/assets and god with his will, if the markets will go up or down for ever... like down for 30 years to save the planet, co2 emissions,etc...


What I didn't liked about US Govermeny & Crypto is i saw cases when some idiots took 6000 or 11 000 that the undercover cop said it's mafia money, prostitution , drugs, but ... when cops came they did not took just those 11 000$, but they took his whole 500 000$ he made from legit traders, coins appreciating, etc.

 

[reallyawesome1111]

My problem is that I had an internet advertising business, so i moved a lot of money, i also kept them in crypto , because those payments processors could always steal 50 000$ from you , and tell you to go to file a police case against them if you want your money back , so police will investigate yourself for being a honest guy... or all kind of craps. Long time ago one company told me because i am from Est europe they want to take my 75 000$ and to pay themself the 35 000$ some russians guy stolen from them, even if i was not russian , i was romanian !!! they were thinking it's fair! I wanted to put all my money in safe business, not perfect money, e-gold, (now defunct) , or some EMIs. I want to invest them in stocks/assets and god with his will, if the markets will go up or down for ever... like down for 30 years to save the planet, co2 emissions,etc...


What I didn't liked about US Govermeny & Crypto is i saw cases when some idiots took 6000 or 11 000 that the undercover cop said it's mafia money, prostitution , drugs, but ... when cops came they did not took just those 11 000$, but they took his whole 500 000$ he made from legit traders, coins appreciating, etc.

Any account used by an unlicensed money transmitting business is potentially subject to forfeiture. In other forfeiture cases if any dirty money enters account, even if most of it is legitimate, the government has methods of accounting ("bad-in-first-out") that can taint lots of the clean assets. It's some third world s**t. In the cases you are talking about maybe they could have contested those seizures if they were at least registered, but if they made the money while unregistered the government can take it all. Also some of these guys agree to forfeit money as part of plea agreement in return for lower sentence, so they could have kept more of the money but they would have had to do more prison time.

Just keep your money in DAI or XMR if you don't like banks. Would not recommend being a P2P trader yourself unless you are thoroughly aware of the risks involved.

 

[pixbix]

But at one point i have to convert DAI and XMR by myself ....

 

[reallyawesome1111]

It's not a crime to be a customer of a p2p exchanger, it's a crime to be one without a license. Or you could just use a regular exchange? It depends on what your goals are.