USDT: 8-9% at YouHodler/Nexo, Non-EU Exchanges?

[DerAufklaerer]

Youhodler, Nexo gives 8-9 % for USDT Holdings.

I think a non EU exchange like Bitfinex, Kucoin..... gives nothing or ?

 

[diatessaron]

Bitstamp - 4.4% on their lend product.
Kraken - 5.7% with opt-in rewards.
On OKX you can earn over 10% if you provide liquidity for their pools.

 

[float]

USDC-DAI on GMX is 13%
USDT APY is 24.7% on NAVI
USDC on Aave is 13% Aave - Open Source Liquidity Protocol

 

[Clank]

I wouldn’t trust platforms like nexo for holding crypto, similar companies with the same business model have gone bankrupt, for me it looks like a PONZI.

I’d rather invest it in a good ETF that gives similar returns.

 

[JackAlabama]

I wouldn’t trust platforms like nexo for holding crypto, similar companies with the same business model have gone bankrupt, for me it looks like a PONZI.

I’d rather invest it in a good ETF that gives similar returns.

i dont use nexo. But to give them credit, they survived the carnage while the loud hype crap like ftx and such went down.

 

[JosephLL]

And where does the yield come from?

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

And where does the yield come from?

In the case of Nexo is mostly corporate loans but they also market make in a few exchanges (and hold TBIlls but to a lesser extend)

In the case of exchanges it mostly comes from using your collateral to lend it to futures traders.

 

[DerAufklaerer]

I wouldn’t trust platforms like nexo for holding crypto, similar companies with the same business model have gone bankrupt, for me it looks like a PONZI.

I’d rather invest it in a good ETF that gives similar returns.

yes but ETF is not crypto

I don't know of any foreign institution where you can hold an ETF.
And then there are the taxes

Now i have checked BITFINEX

LENDING

Its automation

Lookes like

7-10 % depending on the term

I have more confidence in them because they have been on the market for so long

 

[thomasparra]

In the case of Nexo is mostly corporate loans but they also market make in a few exchanges (and hold TBIlls but to a lesser extend)

In the case of exchanges it mostly comes from using your collateral to lend it to futures traders.

If they collateral on T bills (5.3% currently), the other 10-12% come from other individual/business trading collaterals which is incredibly risky. Looking at Interactive Brokers for instance - the collateral interest rates are pretty high for super safe investments (treasuries), hence how can Nexo manage its risk management with a 10% premium with incredibly riskier crypto assets incl tier 1 (BTC ETH)?

This is the reason I always refrained from investing into saving interests products on crypto exchanges, but I would be glad to be proven otherwise. After all 15% on a stable coin can still be a very nice risk premium over other investments (most junk bonds generally yield less than that today).

 

[DerAufklaerer]

USDC-DAI on GMX is 13%
USDT APY is 24.7% on NAVI
USDC on Aave is 13% Aave - Open Source Liquidity Protocol

https://app.gmx.io/#/earn
I'm working out how something like this works

So this is decentralized via my own wallet like Ledger?


https://app.naviprotocol.io/details...a437aaa7d3c74c18e09a95d48aceab08c::coin::COIN
Very high

Base APR:0.61%
Bonus APR:13.26%

The Bonus APR will be airdropped as ARB token

https://app.gmx.io/#/earn

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

If they collateral on T bills (5.3% currently), the other 10-12% come from other individual/business trading collaterals which is incredibly risky. Looking at Interactive Brokers for instance - the collateral interest rates are pretty high for super safe investments (treasuries), hence how can Nexo manage its risk management with a 10% premium with incredibly riskier crypto assets incl tier 1 (BTC ETH)?

Mostly by market making and hedging holding in futures. See the high funding now?
Thats us paying Nexo's yield (and other platforms)

 

[DerAufklaerer]

USDT Flexible Savings
https://www.bybit.com/
<=500USDT Platform Rewards 8.00% + 12.98%
>500USDT12.98%

 

[JohnnyDoe]

Not your keys not your crypto. Did you already forget what happened just a couple of years ago?

 

[Cloudbanck]

Not your keys not your crypto. Did you already forget what happened just a couple of years ago?

No, but when BTC is in a bull market people pay crazy high funding fees to go long BTC with leverage. You can be on the other side of these funding fees by creating a synthetic dollar, i.e. you go short BTC on a platform like bybit or bitmex so you earn the funding fee, and then you separately go long BTC outside the platform (in a cold wallet for example), so you are delta neutral BTC.

On the BTCUSD perpetual on Bybit, right now the funding rate is 0.058% every 8 hours, that's 1.00058^(365*3) = 189% on annual basis. That's where the yield comes from!

Lots of platforms just gain this synthetic dollar yield directly via futures or the perpetuals, and then pass on a small part of it to retail.
It's better to create a synthetic dollar yourself. And then you have to post some collateral, but not for the full notional amount, so you take a much smaller counterparty risk than with Nexo or some platform like that. Also the platforms like Bybit that allow you to trade directly are usually a bit more solid.

I have done this in the last few bullmarkets. Havent had a platform rugpull me yet.

 

[DerAufklaerer]

Not your keys not your crypto. Did you already forget what happened just a couple of years ago?

I have a Ledger but But I don't know if something like this works with stablecoins

I see many wallets
Its mobile wallets

 

[JohnnyDoe]

No, but when BTC is in a bull market people pay crazy high funding fees to go long BTC with leverage. You can be on the other side of these funding fees by creating a synthetic dollar, i.e. you go short BTC on a platform like bybit or bitmex so you earn the funding fee, and then you separately go long BTC outside the platform (in a cold wallet for example), so you are delta neutral BTC.

On the BTCUSD perpetual on Bybit, right now the funding rate is 0.058% every 8 hours, that's 1.00058^(365*3) = 189% on annual basis. That's where the yield comes from!

Lots of platforms just gain this synthetic dollar yield directly via futures or the perpetuals, and then pass on a small part of it to retail.
It's better to create a synthetic dollar yourself. And then you have to post some collateral, but not for the full notional amount, so you take a much smaller counterparty risk than with Nexo or some platform like that. Also the platforms like Bybit that allow you to trade directly are usually a bit more solid.

I have done this in the last few bullmarkets. Havent had a platform rugpull me yet.

You are right, if you are fine with platform risk, but all this in not suitable for 99% of retail crypto users.

 

[thomasparra]

Mostly by market making and hedging holding in futures. See the high funding now?
Thats us paying Nexo's yield (and other platforms)

Not sure i would feel comfortable investing more than 10% of my net worth in this. What about you?

No, but when BTC is in a bull market people pay crazy high funding fees to go long BTC with leverage. You can be on the other side of these funding fees by creating a synthetic dollar, i.e. you go short BTC on a platform like bybit or bitmex so you earn the funding fee, and then you separately go long BTC outside the platform (in a cold wallet for example), so you are delta neutral BTC.

On the BTCUSD perpetual on Bybit, right now the funding rate is 0.058% every 8 hours, that's 1.00058^(365*3) = 189% on annual basis. That's where the yield comes from!

Lots of platforms just gain this synthetic dollar yield directly via futures or the perpetuals, and then pass on a small part of it to retail.
It's better to create a synthetic dollar yourself. And then you have to post some collateral, but not for the full notional amount, so you take a much smaller counterparty risk than with Nexo or some platform like that. Also the platforms like Bybit that allow you to trade directly are usually a bit more solid.

I have done this in the last few bullmarkets. Havent had a platform rugpull me yet.

I am struggling to understand why this is not capitalized on yet. What I have learnt in finance over the years is that there is no free lunch. I would believe 20% on this (already very nice) but almost tripling your investment every year is crazy.

 

[jafo]

And where does the yield come from?

Bravo for asking the hard-hitting questions!

Not your keys not your crypto. Did you already forget what happened just a couple of years ago?

Thanks for reminding me .... my delusional greed was just about to take over my Ventromedial Prefrontal Cortex on a subject I hadn't fully realized was outside my circle of competence

Note to self: I have to measure thrice and cut once because I am my worst enemy

PS. The value of OCT is immeasurable!

 

[Cloudbanck]

Not sure i would feel comfortable investing more than 10% of my net worth in this. What about you?


I am struggling to understand why this is not capitalized on yet. What I have learnt in finance over the years is that there is no free lunch. I would believe 20% on this (already very nice) but almost tripling your investment every year is crazy.

Well, that was the 8 hour perpetual funding fee rate at the time I checked for one single 8 hour period. It spikes up in bull runs, but it doesn't stay at these extremely high levels consistently for long periods of time.
Still, the 2020 - 2021 bull market was fantastic in terms of high (but not crazy high) funding fee rates for a long time. But then the funding rate went negative, meaning shorts pay longs.

Another thing is to take into consideration is how much collateral you deposit to bybit/bitmex or whatever platform you are using - the more you deposit, the more counterparty risk you take, but the smaller the chance of getting stopped out/liquidated out of the short position. I usually do it so Bitcoin has to spike up like 2x - 4x for me to be stopped out.

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

Not sure i would feel comfortable investing more than 10% of my net worth in this. What about you?

I've got close to a milli w them lol. Not financial advice obvs.