Goodbye to Dubai and all UAE Banks friendliness?

[Davis123]

I think there is much more to the stories we are not being told and UK press if famous for defaming UAE in this way. There is a guy who brings baking grade poppy seeds from Europe (if you can't miss 0.02 you can't miss a full bag of poppy seeds either being brought more than once) and he was never held or anything. In fact he was not aware until I made him aware.

There are people who have been living here for more than a decade and somehow nothing happened to them despite plenty of travel trips including trips to Amsterdam for obvious reasons.

Also never say never. I know a very rich guy who was always against muslim countries and somehow since recently he seemed to forget what he was saying years ago. He is a regular to Dubai now with his family

I have been living in UAE for more than a decade now and I didn't see this happening to me when I travel. I just don't bring anything against the law. Simply put you can't complain if you break the law.

 

[Kakarot]

what i wonder is, some ppl who form these UAE companies tell me that WHERE you form your company -- which zone -- doesn't really matter -- what matters if you need to show the bank a lease for an apartment/house to prove you live there -- that's what gets you the bank account, and the zone isn't relevent.

If that's the case, we should all be forming in RAK or the cheap zones and save a fortune.

But then others like Fred say that you need to form in one of the more premier zones if you want any hope of getting banking.

I do not know which of these 2 notions is correct -- but I've heard BOTH positions touted by various companies which do incorporations, and I don't know what to believe at the moment.

Anyone here who can add clarity to this, please post.

 

[CaptK]

what i wonder is, some ppl who form these UAE companies tell me that WHERE you form your company -- which zone -- doesn't really matter -- what matters if you need to show the bank a lease for an apartment/house to prove you live there -- that's what gets you the bank account, and the zone isn't relevent.

If that's the case, we should all be forming in RAK or the cheap zones and save a fortune.

But then others like Fred say that you need to form in one of the more premier zones if you want any hope of getting banking.

I do not know which of these 2 notions is correct -- but I've heard BOTH positions touted by various companies which do incorporations, and I don't know what to believe at the moment.

Anyone here who can add clarity to this, please post.

On paper they say it doesn't matter. In practice it really does.

For example you would think if you open a RAK then RAK Bank should open you an account............... NO CHANCE.

It's the same with Ajman and Ajman Bank it's very difficult. Sharjah are a bit more organised and don't ask as much but you need to have a Sharjah residential address, otherwise they are not really interested.

The benefit of using a Dubai FZ and Dubai bank is that they see the most traffic. The things to bear in mind are, put down as much deposit as possible and take a stupid bank savings product, have a proper business case, show proof that you have experience in that industry, get a tenancy agreement, utility bill and get a local mobile number.

 

[troubled soul]

If you have some kind of shady business than and than You face problem ,and prepare for it .
Regarding genuine business, There will be no problem in Bank account.

Like If you register company for Tax Purpose , You will be fine.
But If you do some shady works than there will be problem.

Bank employee can sense your activity , Like You claiming , You earn millions of dollar and Want to deposit that money with Flexi Desk Business Setup. You will face problem.
Like @Fred said, furnished office gave the Bank idea about seriousness of your business. There is no rule that mention , You have to rent furnished office for bank account . It is for your safety and Hassel free operation.

Now a day It is possible to earn million from using just laptop. For Bank perceptive It is hard to digest . So renting Furnished office is for your safety.

 

[Kakarot]

ok so the bottom line is... we will need a lease in UAE for ourselves (tenancy agreement), we will need some kind of office (beyond the flexidesk faux office provided by the incorporators, right?).

So you're going to have to spend the money to properly fake a life and fully living in dubai -- so for those of us who don't actually want to live there, we need to do these things.

Which is again why i'm trying to determine.... do I spend my money on a better zone like a dubai zone, and skimp on the residency lease and office space?

Or do I form in a cheaper zone like RAK etc, but form up real substance there with my money, get an apartment for myself, open an office, hire a few ppl...

which will be more important for sustaining my company bank accounts? Where should priority be placed?

 

[troubled soul]

ok so the bottom line is... we will need a lease in UAE for ourselves (tenancy agreement), we will need some kind of office (beyond the flexidesk faux office provided by the incorporators, right?).

So you're going to have to spend the money to properly fake a life and fully living in dubai -- so for those of us who don't actually want to live there, we need to do these things.

Which is again why i'm trying to determine.... do I spend my money on a better zone like a dubai zone, and skimp on the residency lease and office space?

Or do I form in a cheaper zone like RAK etc, but form up real substance there with my money, get an apartment for myself, open an office, hire a few ppl...

which will be more important for sustaining my company bank accounts? Where should priority be placed?

For high amount and Safety in Long Run, Dubai free zone with Furnished office will be best , There will be no Problem. Unless You do serious illegal things.
For small amount , Any free zone , Try at your own risk .

In my experience , People with Residential visa and Emirate ID . Do not face many problem.
The difficulty are faced by foreign owner free zone company. It is better to Get Residential Visa. You have just visited one time per 183 year to activate your visa.

In UAE, Rules changes very quickly , Each emirate has its own rules and regulation .

During Covid, You see Dubai and Abu Dhabi has different rules and regulation .

Keep in mind that, If You find some cheap solution ,That works Today. There is no guarantee it works in future.

Setting Up Your Corporate Bank Account in Dubai

Our blog discusses some of the key issues to consider when opening a free zone company bank account in Dubai.

blog.dmcc.ae

It is a top freezone DMCC blog , Hope it help you.

Sorry for my English.

Hope You get it what I trying to say.

 

[Kol019201]

ok so the bottom line is... we will need a lease in UAE for ourselves (tenancy agreement), we will need some kind of office (beyond the flexidesk faux office provided by the incorporators, right?).

So you're going to have to spend the money to properly fake a life and fully living in dubai -- so for those of us who don't actually want to live there, we need to do these things.

Which is again why i'm trying to determine.... do I spend my money on a better zone like a dubai zone, and skimp on the residency lease and office space?

Or do I form in a cheaper zone like RAK etc, but form up real substance there with my money, get an apartment for myself, open an office, hire a few ppl...

which will be more important for sustaining my company bank accounts? Where should priority be placed?

You do not have to fake a life living in dubai and spend all the money on an extra office and rental contract.
You can do that, but I would say it's not necessary at all.

Many people if not most of the people that do business there are only in the UAE for a few weeks a year.
Thats why there is the 1 day in 180 days rule, so people don't have to life there but can still enjoy the 0% and bring their money to the UAE.

 

[Kakarot]

yes but i keep hearing without a rental lease agreement to show a bank -- getting that company bank account is unlikely nowadays.

I don't mind renting a condo there, but here's the problem -- I won't be living there.

And I hear in UAE you cannot sublet legally. So how do I use the apartment i need to rent there? I cannot live in it bc I will be living in another country most of the year.

And apparently I cannot rent it out to another to make back my money on it.

So it's just pure loss unless you are going to live in UAE/Dubai. If you're cool with living there -- I think the UAE company is an amazing deal -- best in the world right now. No personal tax, on corporate tax, no audits etc.

For those of us who aren't wanting to live there... I'm not sure UAE is best. It's still a strong option, but a tad complicated, because you cannot sublet your apartment there, and Dubai is not a cheap place to live and get apartments either.

 

[Fred]

yes but i keep hearing without a rental lease agreement to show a bank -- getting that company bank account is unlikely nowadays.

I don't mind renting a condo there, but here's the problem -- I won't be living there.

And I hear in UAE you cannot sublet legally. So how do I use the apartment i need to rent there? I cannot live in it bc I will be living in another country most of the year.

And apparently I cannot rent it out to another to make back my money on it.

So it's just pure loss unless you are going to live in UAE/Dubai. If you're cool with living there -- I think the UAE company is an amazing deal -- best in the world right now. No personal tax, on corporate tax, no audits etc.

For those of us who aren't wanting to live there... I'm not sure UAE is best. It's still a strong option, but a tad complicated, because you cannot sublet your apartment there, and Dubai is not a cheap place to live and get apartments either.

stop hearing - start doing.

Dubai is your only option nowadays to get decent retail banking for an entity with 0% tax, no audit and bookkeeping requirements - if setup right.

If the above mentioned is your goal you can't find any single alternative.

Everything else is a mix of shell company on a small island together with some EMI or Puerto Rico / Belize / Dominica Bank.

Again to achieve the named goals - 0% tax, no audit, no bookkeeping.

This are not even the most important key facts about the Dubai Setup - the most important key facts are that you receive through the company formation a Residence Visa and decent Retail Banking - so you even have some security when it comes to reporting of your financial statements.

There is a reason why many people dumping US LLC's with Wise/Mercury banking or Seychelles/Belize IBC's with some Lithuania EMI that is limited to SEPA. Back in 2017/2018 it was possible to get Wise for Seychelles / Belize - since 2 years again this is over.

Most people are tired of switching the setups like there pants and that's why they tell themselves better to spend once a little bit more and have time to focus on business and other things in life.

You can't have everything for nothing.

Maybe in your case it makes sense to look into US LLC /Seychelles IBC + EMI if you want to achieve the 0% tax rate.

Otherwise you have to forget about the 0% tax and setup a UK Ltd for 15£ and bank with Wise - for small figures maybe a solution you can consider but again 0% tax and decent retail banking? No way to get it except the UAE right now.

 

[petal355]

This are not even the most important key facts about the Dubai Setup - the most important key facts are that you receive through the company formation a Residence Visa and decent Retail Banking - so you even have some security when it comes to reporting of your financial statements.

Are there financial statements in uae to publish ? What did you mean by "security when it comes to reporting of your finantial statements"

 

[Fred]

Are there financial statements in uae to publish ? What did you mean by "security when it comes to reporting of your finantial statements"

No financial statements.

The Dubai Company Formation grants you the Residence Visa. Once the Residence Visa is received we open the local Business & Personal Bank Account with three Residence Visa.

As the Banks have your Residence Visa, Emirates ID (local ID card) and local phone no. one file no CRS reporting of your Financial Statements are triggered even UAE is since 2018 part of the CRS.

Common Reporting Standard (CRS) - Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development

www.oecd.org

Residence/Citizenship by investment - Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development

www.oecd.org

 

[CaptK]

ok so the bottom line is... we will need a lease in UAE for ourselves (tenancy agreement), we will need some kind of office (beyond the flexidesk faux office provided by the incorporators, right?).

So you're going to have to spend the money to properly fake a life and fully living in dubai -- so for those of us who don't actually want to live there, we need to do these things.

Which is again why i'm trying to determine.... do I spend my money on a better zone like a dubai zone, and skimp on the residency lease and office space?

Or do I form in a cheaper zone like RAK etc, but form up real substance there with my money, get an apartment for myself, open an office, hire a few ppl...

which will be more important for sustaining my company bank accounts? Where should priority be placed?

The Freezone should be the priority. As the saying goes "you get what you pay for".

 

[Golden Fleece]

For those of us who aren't wanting to live there... I'm not sure UAE is best. It's still a strong option, but a tad complicated, because you cannot sublet your apartment there, and Dubai is not a cheap place to live and get apartments either.

If you do not want to live in Dubai or pay residency costs, of course it is not the best option. Pick a low tax country in which you would like to live that only taxes you 5% to 15%. Not everything in life is about avoiding taxes.

The problem is not taxes. The problem is confiscatory taxes. There is a huge difference between paying 5% to 15% in taxes and over 50% in taxes. Enjoy your life. Live where where you want. Pay a fair amount of tax.

 

[Fred]

If you do not want to live in Dubai or pay residency costs, of course it is not the best option. Pick a low tax country in which you would like to live that only taxes you 5% to 15%. Not everything in life is about avoiding taxes.

The problem is not taxes. The problem is confiscatory taxes. There is a huge difference between paying 5% to 15% in taxes and over 50% in taxes. Enjoy your life. Live where where you want. Pay a fair amount of tax.

Well with the mentioned tax rates you end up somewhere in east europe or you have to spend again a lot more compared to Dubai - that was the original point of @Kakarot

 

[Kakarot]

You're right. i think a very useful thread would be a list of the best places to LIVE for tax reasons -- rather than so many threads about where to form your company -- which is actually far, far less important in terms of lowering your overall tax rate.

 

[dradcliff]

No financial statements.

The Dubai Company Formation grants you the Residence Visa. Once the Residence Visa is received we open the local Business & Personal Bank Account with three Residence Visa.

As the Banks have your Residence Visa, Emirates ID (local ID card) and local phone no. one file no CRS reporting of your Financial Statements are triggered even UAE is since 2018 part of the CRS.

Common Reporting Standard (CRS) - Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development

www.oecd.org

Residence/Citizenship by investment - Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development

www.oecd.org

Don't you think that the reporting could change quick rapidly with UAE complying with international rules in the coming years?

Could there be repercussion for the ones that did business in UAE the day UAE joins the OECD?

 

[Fred]

Don't you think that the reporting could change quick rapidly with UAE complying with international rules in the coming years?

Could there be repercussion for the ones that did business in UAE the day UAE joins the OECD?

The UAE is already part of the OECD and the residence by investment through the Company Formation that grants you the Residence Visa is just not triggering the CRS reporting of your financial statements.

Well this is a big part of the economy in the UAE since the very beginning and very important for the whole country - every is related to it - the tourism - the real estate market and so on.

If they change something to this it could be the beginning of the end and therefore they will try every excuse under the sub to keep it like it's currently is.

It's getting tighter every year to arrange banking as they are the ones that facilitate the transactions of all the companies with 0% tax, no audit and bookkeeping requirements so you need to bring from year to year more cash with you - the banks clearly showing the attitude in 2021 - what's in for me?

On the other side duw to COVID you have got chances and banks that didn't considered complex or high risk setups any longer like ENBD - has changed there thinking in 2021 and the bankers clearly mention to us that they have the mission to attract money right now - that's why ENBD currently even onboard RAK ICC and Foundation if you are Emirates ID holder and they already know you trough personal or onshore Freezone Business Account.

 

[Konstanz]

Don't you think that the reporting could change quick rapidly with UAE complying with international rules in the coming years?

Could there be repercussion for the ones that did business in UAE the day UAE joins the OECD?

It will change sooner or later. EU will pressure when the first tax fraud cases appear in UAE.
I think we can expect these changes:
1. More difficult to get residence, by requiring real rental rental / property ownership. Real address. Not some fake address or stay at 'hotel'.
2. More monitoring on how long resident will have to stay to get tax residence certificate. 2 days will not be enough in the future.
3. Increased due diligence in banks.
4. Corporate income tax might appear in the future.
The existing model of 0% corporate tax cannot sustain forever.

After covid now governments in EU will try to collect more taxes and to shut down such tax heavens like UAE

 

[kingx321]

The UAE is already part of the OECD and the residence by investment through the Company Formation that grants you the Residence Visa is just not triggering the CRS reporting of your financial statements.

Well this is a big part of the economy in the UAE since the very beginning and very important for the whole country - every is related to it - the tourism - the real estate market and so on.

If they change something to this it could be the beginning of the end and therefore they will try every excuse under the sub to keep it like it's currently is.

It's getting tighter every year to arrange banking as they are the ones that facilitate the transactions of all the companies with 0% tax, no audit and bookkeeping requirements so you need to bring from year to year more cash with you - the banks clearly showing the attitude in 2021 - what's in for me?

On the other side duw to COVID you have got chances and banks that didn't considered complex or high risk setups any longer like ENBD - has changed there thinking in 2021 and the bankers clearly mention to us that they have the mission to attract money right now - that's why ENBD currently even onboard RAK ICC and Foundation if you are Emirates ID holder and they already know you trough personal or onshore Freezone Business Account.

Hey Fred, i wanted to ask you if it is possible to open a Bank account with a Bank in Dubai for a RAK offshore company. I live in thailand and have no residence in Dubai.

 

[Fred]

Hey Fred, i wanted to ask you if it is possible to open a Bank account with a Bank in Dubai for a RAK offshore company. I live in thailand and have no residence in Dubai.

99% of the banks will give you a flat no without any Residence Visa and Emirates ID.

However if you bring 1m+$ in initial deposit with you we can start some conversations with smaller banks and the rest depends on the company and personal profile.

If the above is the case just send the company documents, bank statements of the company (if any), personal bank statement, your CV and company profile (3-4 lines about the purpose of the company) and your citizenship to [email protected] or use the Messenger via www.dls-dubai.com - in case you have a good Citizenship like Germany we can try some things.

However the best advise I can give you is that you get yourself a Residence Visa through an Onshore Dubai Company and once you have the Residence Visa and Emirates ID you have plenty of options even for your RAK ICC.