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treblepebble

New member
I understand that Singapore is 0% capital gains, which I assumed would make it a crypto tax haven. However, I don't see it mentioned much as an option on here with many opting for Dubai , Portugal.

I wondered if there was a reason for this.

Also, doesnt anyone know where one would start if they were to take Singapore as an option. (Assuming a person has a few million dollars in the bank ready to open an account)

Thanks
 

BlueMist

Entrepreneur
Get in touch Rikvin - they will help. The reason why people opt for Dubai vs Singapore is simplicity. To be a legal resident in Singapore you need company + work permit (Employment Pass). Those are 2 different processes and in Singapore it is a bit more complicated, also you can't take things (EP) for granted. You need to prove that you are required for this job to be present in Singapore and have a good salary band e.g. S$10,000 per month (which will be taxed). The company should also be operational showing some financial activity / paying tax.

In UAE it is tax free, most don't even pay themselves a salary, they just take a dividend. Since both corporate and personal income is tax free, it doesn't matter how it is paid.
 

Martin Everson

Offshore Retiree
Staff member
Mentor Group Gold
Elite Member
@BueMist You nailed it thu&¤#

Just try and become a resident of Singapore without being a serious business person. The only backdoor is to obtain a student visa by picking some random approved course to do.
 

JackAlabama

Entrepreneur
I understand that Singapore is 0% capital gains, which I assumed would make it a crypto tax haven. However, I don't see it mentioned much as an option on here with many opting for Dubai , Portugal.

I wondered if there was a reason for this.

Also, doesnt anyone know where one would start if they were to take Singapore as an option. (Assuming a person has a few million dollars in the bank ready to open an account)

Thanks
Besides being more expensive and way more difficult, it is also a much less nice place than Dubai or Portugal.
 

treblepebble

New member
@BueMist You nailed it thu&¤#

Just try and become a resident of Singapore without being a serious business person. The only backdoor is to obtain a student visa by picking some random approved course to do.

This would be my intention, just to reside there, no business or company (unless it helped to form one), and conduct my overseas personal trading, which I assume would be 0% CGT.

Are you saying even doing just this is quite difficult?

Thanks
 

Mercury

New member
Another option would be to set up a Singapore company to invest/trade cryptos and reside in a territorial tax non CFC neighbouring country (Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand, Philippines, ...). Singapore company dividends are tax free.
Singapore company set up/maintenance including yearly local nominee director (mandatory) salary and accounting is still cheaper and undoubtedly more reliable than a UAE company and banking set up/maintenance.
 

treblepebble

New member
Another option would be to set up a Singapore company to invest/trade cryptos and reside in a territorial tax non CFC neighbouring country (Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand, Philippines, ...). Singapore company dividends are tax free.
Singapore company set up/maintenance including yearly local nominee director (mandatory) salary and accounting is still cheaper and undoubtedly more reliable than a UAE company and banking set up/maintenance.

Thanks for this. This could be what I'm looking for. Although I don't really trade frequently and I'm more of a long term holder. I would be doing a few trades per month though on which the CGT could be in the millions. Also some of the above posters seem to indicate that its very difficult to setup a company for a foreigner?

I wonder though.. If I was to do this, would I be able to donate my existing crypto holdings to this company? or would it require the company to begin afresh from FIAT and invest the funds directly?

Thanks again
 

Bagpacker

Active Member
Another option would be to set up a Singapore company to invest/trade cryptos and reside in a territorial tax non CFC neighbouring country (Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand, Philippines, ...).
At least with regards to the Philippines this does not work. The Philippines does not have a territorial tax system even though some obscure Internet/Nomad/Whatever advisors say so. The Philippine tax code simply states that resident aliens and OFW will be taxed on their Philippine sourced income which means it excludes a certain group of people from the principle of worldwide taxation.
In practice the taxman works as follows: You work for a company. Company abroad, work performed on Philippine soil. Since you are the owner of that company (not publicly traded or listed on any exchange) the entity is considered to be "with you" since it can not act without you.
So, in the case of @treblepebble /Philippines a "company" is counterproductive. Specifically since -according to his post #7- the number of trades is relatively low.
 
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Mercury

New member
According to KPMG: "No CFC regime exists in the Philippines."

The nominee director is supposed to manage the Singapore company. As the owner/shareholder, one will receive dividends (that will not necessarily be remitted in the Phillippines) not salaries.

Obviously, the SG company owner/Phillippines resident who performs the few trades per year is technically working in the Phillippines .... however I can't figure out how the local IRS will know and prove it, especially using VPN.
 

treblepebble

New member
Assuming I wanted to set something like this up, some form of setup in Singapore with a company doing the sells of my holdings over time, but residing in a country like Thailand, who would be the best people to contact?

Thanks again
 

bibing

Active Member
Besides being more expensive and way more difficult, it is also a much less nice place than Dubai or Portugal.
May I ask why you state Singapore is much less nice place than Dubai? (genuinely curious, I have visited SG as a tourist but never lived there)
Singapore company set up/maintenance including yearly local nominee director (mandatory) salary and accounting is still cheaper and undoubtedly more reliable than a UAE company and banking set up/maintenance.
I thought a UAE company would be cheaper?
 

Martin Everson

Offshore Retiree
Staff member
Mentor Group Gold
Elite Member
Are you saying even doing just this is quite difficult?

It would be impossible without deep pockets. Just check out the residency options in Singapore to see what I mean.
 

maxmmm

Entrepreneur
@BueMist You nailed it thu&¤#

Just try and become a resident of Singapore without being a serious business person. The only backdoor is to obtain a student visa by picking some random approved course to do.
What you're saying is that you can come to Singapore to "study", maybe take some courses in feminist dance therapy, open bank accounts, and then leave? Will they close your accounts after you leave?
We need some people from the forum and try and let us know how it went :)
 

JackAlabama

Entrepreneur
What you're saying is that you can come to Singapore to "study", maybe take some courses in feminist dance therapy, open bank accounts, and then leave? Will they close your accounts after you leave?
We need some people from the forum and try and let us know how it went :)
Singapore was very good and easy like 7 years ago. But they become somewhat unreasonably picky and quickly priced one out.
I do not know these days how it is in practice.
 

Bagpacker

Active Member
According to KPMG: "No CFC regime exists in the Philippines."

The nominee director is supposed to manage the Singapore company. As the owner/shareholder, one will receive dividends (that will not necessarily be remitted in the Phillippines) not salaries.

Obviously, the SG company owner/Phillippines resident who performs the few trades per year is technically working in the Phillippines .... however I can't figure out how the local IRS will know and prove it, especially using VPN.
If and how BIR (Bureau of Internal Revenue) figures something out can not and should not be the base of any decision. When I write something I look at legal procedures, local laws and the relevant tax code.
I do not understand why you insist on your advice when it causes more harm than good .... ca#"! !

On a more general note:
KPMG/ PwC/ Deloitte/EY and the like are mostly correct when it comes to the core issue of a sentence. However, they rarely do take into account the wider picture when it comes to those free-of-charge info sheets. After enjoying the free-of-charge info it is up to the potential client to either hire a professional advisor or to do his own research.
Look through this forum, enter "Georgia" or "Portugal" and you see the result when relying on freely available "internet information".
Example: There are many countries who do not have a capital gains tax. More often than not, capital gains are then taxed as regular income. Still, info sheets write that there is no capital gains tax which is technically correct but does not help much.
Same is valid for CFC. Just because there is no CFC regime does not mean that the country in question does not tax you on work performed in the country, even if you try to hide behind an obscure "company"!
 

Mercury

New member
If and how BIR (Bureau of Internal Revenue) figures something out can not and should not be the base of any decision. When I write something I look at legal procedures, local laws and the relevant tax code.
I do not understand why you insist on your advice when it causes more harm than good .... ca#"! !

I don't give any advice, just share my personal thoughts on how things are managed in most of the countries in the south-east Asia region where I stay since several years.

There could be a (sometimes huge) gap between what you read and the real life.

From what I've seen, ever changing laws and rules exist but enforcement is strongly lacking. Corruption is heavily rampant and any issue, if caught (meaning reported), can easily be solved with a brown envelope for a tiny % of the fine. Wealthy locals and smart foreigners are aware of that and use and abuse it.

Coming from the western world, I've run businesses here and there always sticking with the law and rules. The outcome is that I've paid the high price for no help/allowance when in need (Covid situation for instance). Needless to say that, despite complying, some locals/officials will keep trying to scam you at every corner.

As the old proverb truly says: "When in Rome, do as the Romans do". But again, to each his own.
 

JackAlabama

Entrepreneur
Ok thanks.

Out of curiosity how much would I need. I have probably $2-3M I'd be prepared to move there but I am guessing they are interested in much more
That could work, but you would need a somewhat stronger case for a business, like some AI development project or something along the line.
But you need to pay yourself a not too low salary, pay the 17% tax on it and also pay the high local cost of living.

Im a bit dated on Singapore, as I left it years ago.
 

Bagpacker

Active Member
I don't give any advice, just share my personal thoughts on how things are managed in most of the countries in the south-east Asia region where I stay since several years.

There could be a (sometimes huge) gap between what you read and the real life.

From what I've seen, ever changing laws and rules exist but enforcement is strongly lacking. Corruption is heavily rampant and any issue, if caught (meaning reported), can easily be solved with a brown envelope for a tiny % of the fine. Wealthy locals and smart foreigners are aware of that and use and abuse it.

Coming from the western world, I've run businesses here and there always sticking with the law and rules. The outcome is that I've paid the high price for no help/allowance when in need (Covid situation for instance). Needless to say that, despite complying, some locals/officials will keep trying to scam you at every corner.

As the old proverb truly says: "When in Rome, do as the Romans do". But again, to each his own.
You don't get the point ...

At least with regards to a resident alien in the Philippines your suggestion of hiding something behind an obscure "company" is counterproductive: You pay for something which you do not need (i.e. "company" set up) and in addition you may face a tax bill for something that is otherwise tax-free!

Even the Romans (in the Philippines) would not do that!
 

Mercury

New member
You don't get the point ...

At least with regards to a resident alien in the Philippines your suggestion of hiding something behind an obscure "company" is counterproductive: You pay for something which you do not need (i.e. "company" set up) and in addition you may face a tax bill for something that is otherwise tax-free!

Even the Romans (in the Philippines) would not do that!

Where did I suggest to hide something behind an obscure company??

Of course @treblepebble may not need a company to cash out his cryptos but he's the one who asks about the benefits of incorporating a SG company for such a purpose. Then raised the point of the residency.
As residence in SG can be difficult to obtain, I just add that an option could be to reside in a territorial tax country to receive the dividends tax free from the SG company.

Your turn, what is your point in this thread? Can you answer the OP question? ... or just elaborate on what the Romans would do in his shoes as it seems you know them well smi(&%
 
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