Revolut reporting info to Tax agency

[RedEvil1991]

Hello there, yesterday I got a notification from the Revolut app for add my TIN (tax id number), because Revulut must send informations about their customers. This wasn't clear, so I chatted with Revolut live agent asking what that means, if they're sending info to the tax agency of country where the Account holder is from. They replied this:

Thanks for waiting #####, the one who will receive your information, it is the Lithuanian State Tax Inspectorate that is responsible for collecting and sharing this information. All information share is defined in the LAW ON TAX ADMINISTRATION OF THE REPUBLIC OF LITHUANIA.

And I asked if Lithuanian agency will send those info at other tax agency. He replied

Revolut has an obligation by law to report the year end account balances to local tax authorities in Lithuania annually, or provide information on their request. Revolut does not share your information on an automated basis or directly with tax authorities of other countries, it is the Lithuanian tax authority that’s responsible for collecting and sending this to other local authorities under the Standard for Automatic Exchange of Financial Account Information, developed by the OECD, which represents the international consensus on automatic exchange of financial account information for tax purposes, on a reciprocal basis.

Then I asked what kind of information are shared and he replied:

2. The following information is shared with regards to clients non-resident in Lithuania (applicable for Revolut): a. Pursuant to Article 61, Revolut has obligation to provide information about user balance at year end according to cross-border agreements, in which Lithuania takes part (FATCA, CRS). Both resident and non-resident: Pursuant to Article 55, account opening and closing fact is reported within 3 business days of the event

I asked him what does it means for "balance at the year and, and if they're sending also movement of the account, but he didn't know that, he asked also to other component of the team and they didn't know that, so I told him that I've found the argoment on Google so I didn't need their reply anymore (just because I was scared to get too much attention)

So now I want to know, what they're sending? Just account balance at the year end (31 December) or also the pay in and payouts? Because this is not clear, and I also know that in italy people must declare their foreign account only if the balance has passed also just for 1 day 15k value or if the annual average balance is more than 5k...

I'm too worried about that...because if they just see the final balance at 31th December 2020 thats not a problem, but if they also get all the pay out and pay in that a big problem.

Some months ago I've read on Revolut blog that the account holders had the obligation to declare his account because Revulut didn't do, from when they changed?...I think 1/2 month..

 

[Fred]

Nothing new.

@Gediminas told the people already a year ago.

In General it's getting tighter each year - even the big ones like Wise and Revolut get pressure to follow the rules.

Regarding your case - everything somebody tells you now would be speculation.

The best advise somebody can give you is stop using discount EMI's to hide money from the tax authorities from now.

In 2021 you get yourself a other Tax Residence (best case tax free) on the paper and verify your financial institutions (best case real physical banks) with this new Tax Residence. To make it bullet proof you spend time in your new Tax Residence.

Yes, that's not cheap and not easy. But usually everybody should already have noticed that the average joe sooner then later doesn't have any loopholes left and the game will be continued by the big boys till the very end - which is coming for sure.

 

[RedEvil1991]

Nothing new.

@Gediminas told the people already a year ago.

In General it's getting tighter each year - even the big ones like Wise and Revolut get pressure to follow the rules.

Regarding your case - everything somebody tells you now would be speculation.

The best advise somebody can give you is stop using discount EMI's to hide money from the tax authorities from now.

In 2021 you get yourself a other Tax Residence (best case tax free) on the paper and verify your financial institutions (best case real physical banks) with this new Tax Residence. To make it bullet proof you spend time in your new Tax Residence.

Yes, that's not cheap and not easy. But usually everybody should already have noticed that the average joe sooner then later doesn't have any loopholes left and the game will be continued by the big boys till the very end - which is coming for sure.

Thanks for the reply, I just hope revolut will report the balance at the end of the year 2020 that was 3 dollar, so it will not be a problem i think. Different is the case where they see all the money I moved through revolut (payin/payout). I stopped all movements from revolut now have some money to withdraw at the atm and then I'll stop using Revolut. What should I do? Close the account or leave it opened with not transactions in the next years? ...because revolut told me if I close the account they will send a notification to Lithuanian tax agency about the closing, in 3 days. I dont know whats the best. I just want to stop moving money hoping that I will not get any verify from the tax agency of my country if they just check the balance at the year end.

 

[Fred]

Thanks for the reply, I just hope revolut will report the balance at the end of the year 2020 that was 3 dollar, so it will not be a problem i think. Different is the case where they see all the money I moved through revolut (payin/payout). I stopped all movements from revolut now have some money to withdraw at the atm and then I'll stop using Revolut. What should I do? Close the account or leave it opened with not transactions in the next years? ...because revolut told me if I close the account they will send a notification to Lithuanian tax agency about the closing, in 3 days. I dont know whats the best. I just want to stop moving money hoping that I will not get any verify from the tax agency of my country if they just check the balance at the year end.

If they consider you a big fish it's already too late and they will go after you.

So if you close now the account or not won't make any difference about the decision going after you or not.

 

[RedEvil1991]

If they consider you a big fish it's already too late and they will go after you.

So if you close now the account or not won't make any difference about the decision going after you or not.

But if they see my end year balance just 4 euro they will check other info? What is meant as big fish?

 

[Martin Everson]

Some months ago I've read on Revolut blog that the account holders had the obligation to declare his account because Revulut didn't do, from when they changed?...I think 1/2 month..

Since Revolut became a licensed bank and moved majority of non-UK clients relationships to Revolut Bank UAB. They have to comply with CRS. You can check if your with Revolut bank UAB by simply producing a statement where you will see your E-money account and on last pages your Revolut Bank account. Money gets swept from your e-money account to the bank account in Lithuania.

What should I do? Close the account or leave it opened with not transactions in the next years? ...because revolut told me if I close the account they will send a notification to Lithuanian tax agency about the closing, in 3 days.

If you choose to close the account now then any amounts credited or debited from the account in the reporting period until closure remain reportable.

But if they see my end year balance just 4 euro they will check other info?

Wouldn't CRS be so easy to defeat if everyone just emptied their account before end of year. It's nice to be wishful as it helps people sleep at night. I mean what was the OECD thinking leaving such a complex international system with a massive obvious loophole where one can just empty their account before year end and then fill it up again after report has taken place .

Anyway back in the real world and CRS is reporting total amounts credited and debited, interest paid and year end balance etc.

 

[kkein]

So i need to ask one clarification here: Every time i log into the app, Revolut is nagging me if i want to convert my account into regular bank account with deposit protection up to 100k€. I regularly dismiss that.
So far nobody has asked my TIN.
So i wonder: do they ask only to those with "bank accounts" or also to those with "EMI accounts" (that, up till now, have no EU obligation to report)?

 

[NicolasMaduro]

So i need to ask one clarification here: Every time i log into the app, Revolut is nagging me if i want to convert my account into regular bank account with deposit protection up to 100k€. I regularly dismiss that.
So far nobody has asked my TIN.
So i wonder: do they ask only to those with "bank accounts" or also to those with "EMI accounts" (that, up till now, have no EU obligation to report)?

I mean that makes sense. If you convert it into a regular bank account, then they have to report you trough CRS

 

[Martin Everson]

So i need to ask one clarification here: Every time i log into the app, Revolut is nagging me if i want to convert my account into regular bank account with deposit protection up to 100k€. I regularly dismiss that.

Ahh so you refuse to migrate your account to Revolut bank and get your nice 100k deposit protection .

So far nobody has asked my TIN.
So i wonder: do they ask only to those with "bank accounts" or also to those with " EMI accounts" (that, up till now, have no EU obligation to report)?

If I remember you have to give TIN when prompted during switch to Revolut Bank. But you can also check in your "Personal Details" -> "Additional Information" if a tax residency is specified there. Maybe that section does not exist on yours as you have not switched to the bank.

 

[RedEvil1991]

What happens if I don't put my TIN? You know?

 

[RedEvil1991]

I mean that makes sense. If you convert it into a regular bank account, then they have to report you trough CRS

Why in revolut policy the talks only of report the balance at the year end?

 

[Markafoni]

Since Revolut became a licensed bank and moved majority of non-UK clients relationships to Revolut Bank UAB. They have to comply with CRS. You can check if your with Revolut bank UAB by simply producing a statement where you will see your E-money account and on last pages your Revolut Bank account. Money gets swept from your e-money account to the bank account in Lithuania.



If you choose to close the account now then any amounts credited or debited from the account in the reporting period until closure remain reportable.




Wouldn't CRS be so easy to defeat if everyone just emptied their account before end of year. It's nice to be wishful as it helps people sleep at night. I mean what was the OECD thinking leaving such a complex international system with a massive obvious loophole where one can just empty their account before year end and then fill it up again after report has taken place .

Anyway back in the real world and CRS is reporting total amounts credited and debited, interest paid and year end balance etc.

I am non EU - non US resident with a UK Revolut Stealth accouınt. Would they ask me for a TIN number if I do maximum of 15k EURO monthly transaction? Because I do not have one or do I have a business - I just use a personal account.

 

[spacely]

So i need to ask one clarification here: Every time i log into the app, Revolut is nagging me if i want to convert my account into regular bank account with deposit protection up to 100k€. I regularly dismiss that.
So far nobody has asked my TIN.
So i wonder: do they ask only to those with "bank accounts" or also to those with "EMI accounts" (that, up till now, have no EU obligation to report)?

I have not switched to "Revolut Bank" and still received the request on my regular EMI account. And many people around me received it, even my barber lol

I suggest that best we can do is just stop using it until we ready to pay taxes or switch our tax residency to tax-friendly jurisdiction.

 

[kkein]

Nevermind, i got it too now.. I wonder if it's Bank of Lithuania that forces them, and why Transferwise hasn't done that yet..
However, in my case it was just a notification. Inside the app nothing forcing me to do it.. At least for now..

 

[Dandyline]

Just choose a tax free country as your tx residence in the list. They dont validate it.

 

[zzzzzz]

What happens if I don't put my TIN? You know?

They don't really need your TIN. When Lithuanian taxman sends CRS information to your country of residence, your taxman can identify you without TIN (via address, birth date, name, surname).

 

[kkein]

Just choose a tax free country as your tx residence in the list. They dont validate it.

Which would that be?

 

[Martin Everson]

The TIN is optional and a nice to have but is not mandatory for CRS reporting. Just because you have not entered a TIN does not mean you will not get reported to your country of residency. Your ID and passport can be used.

I discussed this is great detail in below thread. You will get CRS reported regardless of whether you enter a TIN or not...period!!!!

https://www.offshorecorptalk.com/threads/do-prepaid-cards-fall-under-the-crs.29320/post-131436

 

[kkein]

yea here the real question is whether Revolut has started to report EMI accounts or not, as it is not required so far?

 

[newNomad]

Check the contract you signed, if it is with the Payment institution Revolut (EMI) AND you did not migrate to the bank deposit guarantee and do not use any services of Revolut bank -> The EMI exemption holds and they are unlikely to report

For new accounts though they collect TIN also always, even if it is with the Payment EMI Revolut and not with Revolut Bank. Because they want to have it handy since most of the users later migrate to bank or use some account funding methods which require involvement of the bank / conversion of deposit to e-money. I am unsure whether now actually at some point they onboard everyone automatically to the bank or not and whether they report or not, maybe no if only EMI but don't touch anything offered by the bank (deposit guarantee....)