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Setting Up an Anonymous, Low-Cost Tax-Free Company Globally in 2024 with Minimal Compliance Requirements?
- Thread starter happyjohn
- Start date
Those are increasingly outmoded requirements. If you keep holding on to the past, the present won't wait for you, and then the future will hit you like a bag of bricks to the face.
Don't start a business if you can't afford accounting or other basic things.
It costs very little and it can help you in many ways (banking, PSPs, taxes). What are you doing running a business if you can't even budget some basic paperwork to be done for it?
I can understand pushing back against audits, but just pure, simple, basic accounting...
Raise money if you need to in order to meet your business needs. Friends and family. Bank loans. Angel investors. Seed investors. VC/PE. You have the drive — go out and find them. OPM is great. Just pay them back and give them value.
Don't start a foreign company if you can't afford to meet substance requirements.
Very few jurisdictions haven't implemented substance requirements yet (for example Samoa), but they are a dying breed. OECD comes for all.
The degree of substance requirements vary but don't look at the relaxed requirement in jurisdiction X today and expect them to stay that way. Be smart. Look at what's going on and deduce what the next move is going to be. Prepare for that. Monitor the situation.
Don't commit tax fraud/tax evasion.
This includes VAT fraud in EU/EEA/UK.
Without a doubt the dumbest crimes you can commit, because the burden of proof is often reversed. You'll probably end up paying the tax you should have, and more in penalties and loss of opportunities.
This brings us to...
Residence is key.
If you don't like the taxes where you live, don't live there. I swear there is pure tax-brain-rot in the Spanish tap water.
Go live somewhere else. The world is big and you can find different tax incentives all over the world.
The Perpetual Traveller dream is just that: a dream. I can't deny there are people out there who do it. But it's getting harder. More and more are opting for genuine, bonafide tax residence somewhere.
Be OK with paying more than zero tax.
It's possible (see 0% tax for digital nomad achievable?), but to a lot of people, simply paying less tax leads to a better quality of life than striving for zero tax.
Paying even just a modicum of tax gives an air of legitimacy that can helpful.
Banking secrecy is dead.
Banking secrecy is gone. You can run around the world chasing non-CRS territories but they are running out, and the last ones standing are going to be places you probably don't want to put your money anyway.
Establish your residence and business in such a way that secrecy is a non-issue.
Corporate secrecy is dying.
Forget anonymity. Instead, understand what is public, what is limited, and what is private.
Public = anyone can view.
Limited = some information is public, some is limited (to law enforcement, to media with good cause, to government).
Private = only you and the government know.
Consider that data leaks, both from service providers/lawyers and from corporate registers themselves.
Use nominees cleverly and carefully.
Asset protection is alive.
Don't buy off-the-shelf solutions. Get something bespoke, set up with the help of people who understand all applicable laws and risks. Don't google "cheap cook islands trust fast instant setup i'm being sued". Plan ahead. Understand your risks. Be realistic.
Good asset protection usually doesn't rely on secrecy (see previous two points).
Pay peanuts, get monkeys.
There are times in life when monkeys are great. They can be great companions at your jungle villa in Costa Rica or fun to encounter in the wild or just walking around Gibraltar or Singapore.
What they are not good for is setting up companies, opening bank accounts, and tax planning.
Just like you don't sell your own time and skills for cheap, neither should you expect others to. Experience costs.
Don't get ripped off, though. Perform due diligence on service providers. And explain your scope to them clearly. Even a good, trustworthy lawyer can go above and beyond racking up billable hours if you don't tell them exactly what to do (ideally agree on pricing in advance).
Paralysis by analysis.
I see so many OCT users fall for this.
Are you entrepreneurs or wannapreneurs?
Asking questions, doing research, and analysing options are good things that you should be doing.
But too often I see people get stuck in hypotheticals and — by the looks of it — getting nowhere, instead worrying about to cash out their 6 trillion USD in crypto using their Cambodian passport while residing in Paraguay. In reality, the business is either non-existent or just puttering by.
Grow your business.
This is probably the most important part. If you have a business that's doing well, focus on growing it if you can continue to scale it up.
Don't take your 500,000 USD/year business offshore just to save on taxes. You probably can't save on taxes (legally) and even if you do, I'd bet the costs of doing so aren't that much different from the costs of paying tax.
Instead, grow your business. Get it big enough that going international starts making sense, factoring in all the costs and complexities thereof.
KYC: Banks are banks are banks.
— Look at all those ducks and what a nice row they form! #inspirational
This comes back to basic accounting. Companies with basic accounting don't struggle with showing invoices and agreements when banks ask.
If you want to use fiat money, you have to play by the fiat money rules. This means SOF (Source of Funds) and SOW (Source of Wealth) checks and disclosure.
Keep all statements, invoices, agreements, receipts. Maintain fresh bank statements and utility bills/proof of address. File your taxes. Keep copies of the returns. Store it all safely and redundantly.
Things are tough already and will only get tougher. Be prepared for that.
The End
Don't start a business if you can't afford accounting or other basic things.
It costs very little and it can help you in many ways (banking, PSPs, taxes). What are you doing running a business if you can't even budget some basic paperwork to be done for it?
I can understand pushing back against audits, but just pure, simple, basic accounting...
Raise money if you need to in order to meet your business needs. Friends and family. Bank loans. Angel investors. Seed investors. VC/PE. You have the drive — go out and find them. OPM is great. Just pay them back and give them value.
Don't start a foreign company if you can't afford to meet substance requirements.
Very few jurisdictions haven't implemented substance requirements yet (for example Samoa), but they are a dying breed. OECD comes for all.
The degree of substance requirements vary but don't look at the relaxed requirement in jurisdiction X today and expect them to stay that way. Be smart. Look at what's going on and deduce what the next move is going to be. Prepare for that. Monitor the situation.
Don't commit tax fraud/tax evasion.
This includes VAT fraud in EU/EEA/UK.
Without a doubt the dumbest crimes you can commit, because the burden of proof is often reversed. You'll probably end up paying the tax you should have, and more in penalties and loss of opportunities.
This brings us to...
Residence is key.
If you don't like the taxes where you live, don't live there. I swear there is pure tax-brain-rot in the Spanish tap water.
Go live somewhere else. The world is big and you can find different tax incentives all over the world.
The Perpetual Traveller dream is just that: a dream. I can't deny there are people out there who do it. But it's getting harder. More and more are opting for genuine, bonafide tax residence somewhere.
Be OK with paying more than zero tax.
It's possible (see 0% tax for digital nomad achievable?), but to a lot of people, simply paying less tax leads to a better quality of life than striving for zero tax.
Paying even just a modicum of tax gives an air of legitimacy that can helpful.
Banking secrecy is dead.
Banking secrecy is gone. You can run around the world chasing non-CRS territories but they are running out, and the last ones standing are going to be places you probably don't want to put your money anyway.
Establish your residence and business in such a way that secrecy is a non-issue.
Corporate secrecy is dying.
Forget anonymity. Instead, understand what is public, what is limited, and what is private.
Public = anyone can view.
Limited = some information is public, some is limited (to law enforcement, to media with good cause, to government).
Private = only you and the government know.
Consider that data leaks, both from service providers/lawyers and from corporate registers themselves.
Use nominees cleverly and carefully.
Asset protection is alive.
Don't buy off-the-shelf solutions. Get something bespoke, set up with the help of people who understand all applicable laws and risks. Don't google "cheap cook islands trust fast instant setup i'm being sued". Plan ahead. Understand your risks. Be realistic.
Good asset protection usually doesn't rely on secrecy (see previous two points).
Pay peanuts, get monkeys.
There are times in life when monkeys are great. They can be great companions at your jungle villa in Costa Rica or fun to encounter in the wild or just walking around Gibraltar or Singapore.
What they are not good for is setting up companies, opening bank accounts, and tax planning.
Just like you don't sell your own time and skills for cheap, neither should you expect others to. Experience costs.
Don't get ripped off, though. Perform due diligence on service providers. And explain your scope to them clearly. Even a good, trustworthy lawyer can go above and beyond racking up billable hours if you don't tell them exactly what to do (ideally agree on pricing in advance).
Paralysis by analysis.
I see so many OCT users fall for this.
Are you entrepreneurs or wannapreneurs?
Asking questions, doing research, and analysing options are good things that you should be doing.
But too often I see people get stuck in hypotheticals and — by the looks of it — getting nowhere, instead worrying about to cash out their 6 trillion USD in crypto using their Cambodian passport while residing in Paraguay. In reality, the business is either non-existent or just puttering by.
Grow your business.
This is probably the most important part. If you have a business that's doing well, focus on growing it if you can continue to scale it up.
Don't take your 500,000 USD/year business offshore just to save on taxes. You probably can't save on taxes (legally) and even if you do, I'd bet the costs of doing so aren't that much different from the costs of paying tax.
Instead, grow your business. Get it big enough that going international starts making sense, factoring in all the costs and complexities thereof.
KYC: Banks are banks are banks.
— Look at all those ducks and what a nice row they form! #inspirational
This comes back to basic accounting. Companies with basic accounting don't struggle with showing invoices and agreements when banks ask.
If you want to use fiat money, you have to play by the fiat money rules. This means SOF (Source of Funds) and SOW (Source of Wealth) checks and disclosure.
Keep all statements, invoices, agreements, receipts. Maintain fresh bank statements and utility bills/proof of address. File your taxes. Keep copies of the returns. Store it all safely and redundantly.
Things are tough already and will only get tougher. Be prepared for that.
The End
Great essay, however, it's quite discouraging for the type of forum this is to know that there are no such options left and everything one would setup would be a failure long term. Could have given some hope at least haha..Those are increasingly outmoded requirements. If you keep holding on to the past, the present won't wait for you, and then the future will hit you like a bag of bricks to the face.
Don't start a business if you can't afford accounting or other basic things.
It costs very little and it can help you in many ways (banking, PSPs, taxes). What are you doing running a business if you can't even budget some basic paperwork to be done for it?
I can understand pushing back against audits, but just pure, simple, basic accounting...
Raise money if you need to in order to meet your business needs. Friends and family. Bank loans. Angel investors. Seed investors. VC/PE. You have the drive — go out and find them. OPM is great. Just pay them back and give them value.
Don't start a foreign company if you can't afford to meet substance requirements.
Very few jurisdictions haven't implemented substance requirements yet (for example Samoa), but they are a dying breed. OECD comes for all.
The degree of substance requirements vary but don't look at the relaxed requirement in jurisdiction X today and expect them to stay that way. Be smart. Look at what's going on and deduce what the next move is going to be. Prepare for that. Monitor the situation.
Don't commit tax fraud/tax evasion.
This includes VAT fraud in EU/EEA/UK.
Without a doubt the dumbest crimes you can commit, because the burden of proof is often reversed. You'll probably end up paying the tax you should have, and more in penalties and loss of opportunities.
This brings us to...
Residence is key.
If you don't like the taxes where you live, don't live there. I swear there is pure tax-brain-rot in the Spanish tap water.
Go live somewhere else. The world is big and you can find different tax incentives all over the world.
The Perpetual Traveller dream is just that: a dream. I can't deny there are people out there who do it. But it's getting harder. More and more are opting for genuine, bonafide tax residence somewhere.
Be OK with paying more than zero tax.
It's possible (see 0% tax for digital nomad achievable?), but to a lot of people, simply paying less tax leads to a better quality of life than striving for zero tax.
Paying even just a modicum of tax gives an air of legitimacy that can helpful.
Banking secrecy is dead.
Banking secrecy is gone. You can run around the world chasing non-CRS territories but they are running out, and the last ones standing are going to be places you probably don't want to put your money anyway.
Establish your residence and business in such a way that secrecy is a non-issue.
Corporate secrecy is dying.
Forget anonymity. Instead, understand what is public, what is limited, and what is private.
Public = anyone can view.
Limited = some information is public, some is limited (to law enforcement, to media with good cause, to government).
Private = only you and the government know.
Consider that data leaks, both from service providers/lawyers and from corporate registers themselves.
Use nominees cleverly and carefully.
Asset protection is alive.
Don't buy off-the-shelf solutions. Get something bespoke, set up with the help of people who understand all applicable laws and risks. Don't google "cheap cook islands trust fast instant setup i'm being sued". Plan ahead. Understand your risks. Be realistic.
Good asset protection usually doesn't rely on secrecy (see previous two points).
Pay peanuts, get monkeys.
There are times in life when monkeys are great. They can be great companions at your jungle villa in Costa Rica or fun to encounter in the wild or just walking around Gibraltar or Singapore.
What they are not good for is setting up companies, opening bank accounts, and tax planning.
Just like you don't sell your own time and skills for cheap, neither should you expect others to. Experience costs.
Don't get ripped off, though. Perform due diligence on service providers. And explain your scope to them clearly. Even a good, trustworthy lawyer can go above and beyond racking up billable hours if you don't tell them exactly what to do (ideally agree on pricing in advance).
Paralysis by analysis.
I see so many OCT users fall for this.
Are you entrepreneurs or wannapreneurs?
Asking questions, doing research, and analysing options are good things that you should be doing.
But too often I see people get stuck in hypotheticals and — by the looks of it — getting nowhere, instead worrying about to cash out their 6 trillion USD in crypto using their Cambodian passport while residing in Paraguay. In reality, the business is either non-existent or just puttering by.
Grow your business.
This is probably the most important part. If you have a business that's doing well, focus on growing it if you can continue to scale it up.
Don't take your 500,000 USD/year business offshore just to save on taxes. You probably can't save on taxes (legally) and even if you do, I'd bet the costs of doing so aren't that much different from the costs of paying tax.
Instead, grow your business. Get it big enough that going international starts making sense, factoring in all the costs and complexities thereof.
KYC: Banks are banks are banks.
View attachment 5980
— Look at all those ducks and what a nice row they form! #inspirational
This comes back to basic accounting. Companies with basic accounting don't struggle with showing invoices and agreements when banks ask.
If you want to use fiat money, you have to play by the fiat money rules. This means SOF (Source of Funds) and SOW (Source of Wealth) checks and disclosure.
Keep all statements, invoices, agreements, receipts. Maintain fresh bank statements and utility bills/proof of address. File your taxes. Keep copies of the returns. Store it all safely and redundantly.
Things are tough already and will only get tougher. Be prepared for that.
The End
It might seem that way but the forum is more active than ever (I think), thanks to a shift in focus towards residence and compliant solutions. There is way more to discuss, research, and discover now than previously.
OCT in 2009: just form an offshore company in Seychelles and open a bank account in Panama, you'll be anonymous.
OCT in 2014: just form an offshore company in Seychelles and open a bank account in Panama, you'll be anonymous as long as there are no TIEA requests which Seychelles and Panama both often don't respect if they sign them at all. Just don't be a US citizen.
OCT in 2019: just form an offshore company in Seychelles and open an EMI account. Maybe it's anonymous? Probably not for long.
OCT in 2024: set up residence in X, form a company in X or Y, and get a bank account in X, Y, or Z. You won't be anonymous but with the right structure, you'll be out of scope of taxation in your home country. Also here are some ways to cash out crypto. Plus information about nominees, lawyers, corporate service providers, and more.
Those who keep up with the times won't struggle. Those who are still looking for that 2009–2014 (if not even older...) era offshore financial services industry are falling further and further beyond each year.
We are already there: set up residence in Panama, form a US LLC and get a US bank account.
While adhering to tax laws is essential, part of our discussion here usually involves exploring the complexities and potential strategies within those legal frameworks. So, while @Sols advice is sound for straightforward situations, many here are likely interested in understanding the broader spectrum of legal and financial planning options available within the scope of the law.
Likewise, we can say that answering emails or taking business calls on a leisure trip abroad shouldn't be done if you haven't registered your employment there or do not have a work permit, but it's almost considered everyday practice despite being technically illegal and can theoretically lead to legal issues, including fines, deportation, or a ban from re-entering the country.
What's the stance of the forum administration here? I understand the forum doesn't want to see people endorsing illegal practices, but discussing risks should be fine.
And the above is exactly why I quit the offshore industry in 2019.
I am not after new clients anymore. I only focus on optimisation for the handful of existing clients I work for and with. Since the crypto billionaires came to knock on my door I quickly got fed up.
I love to hangout here, partly for nostalgic reasons (the 90's, despite being the wild Wild West were really amazing offshore wise) and partly to help where I can.
Nice to see that the changes are acknowledged here as well and that the focus is shifting towards compliancy and working within the legal (grey) boundaries. There is still a lot possible. The minimum requirements are just changing.
Those are increasingly outmoded requirements. If you keep holding on to the past, the present won't wait for you, and then the future will hit you like a bag of bricks to the face.
Don't start a business if you can't afford accounting or other basic things.
It costs very little and it can help you in many ways (banking, PSPs, taxes). What are you doing running a business if you can't even budget some basic paperwork to be done for it?
I can understand pushing back against audits, but just pure, simple, basic accounting...
Raise money if you need to in order to meet your business needs. Friends and family. Bank loans. Angel investors. Seed investors. VC/PE. You have the drive — go out and find them. OPM is great. Just pay them back and give them value.
Don't start a foreign company if you can't afford to meet substance requirements.
Very few jurisdictions haven't implemented substance requirements yet (for example Samoa), but they are a dying breed. OECD comes for all.
The degree of substance requirements vary but don't look at the relaxed requirement in jurisdiction X today and expect them to stay that way. Be smart. Look at what's going on and deduce what the next move is going to be. Prepare for that. Monitor the situation.
Don't commit tax fraud/tax evasion.
This includes VAT fraud in EU/EEA/UK.
Without a doubt the dumbest crimes you can commit, because the burden of proof is often reversed. You'll probably end up paying the tax you should have, and more in penalties and loss of opportunities.
This brings us to...
Residence is key.
If you don't like the taxes where you live, don't live there. I swear there is pure tax-brain-rot in the Spanish tap water.
Go live somewhere else. The world is big and you can find different tax incentives all over the world.
The Perpetual Traveller dream is just that: a dream. I can't deny there are people out there who do it. But it's getting harder. More and more are opting for genuine, bonafide tax residence somewhere.
Be OK with paying more than zero tax.
It's possible (see 0% tax for digital nomad achievable?), but to a lot of people, simply paying less tax leads to a better quality of life than striving for zero tax.
Paying even just a modicum of tax gives an air of legitimacy that can helpful.
Banking secrecy is dead.
Banking secrecy is gone. You can run around the world chasing non-CRS territories but they are running out, and the last ones standing are going to be places you probably don't want to put your money anyway.
Establish your residence and business in such a way that secrecy is a non-issue.
Corporate secrecy is dying.
Forget anonymity. Instead, understand what is public, what is limited, and what is private.
Public = anyone can view.
Limited = some information is public, some is limited (to law enforcement, to media with good cause, to government).
Private = only you and the government know.
Consider that data leaks, both from service providers/lawyers and from corporate registers themselves.
Use nominees cleverly and carefully.
Asset protection is alive.
Don't buy off-the-shelf solutions. Get something bespoke, set up with the help of people who understand all applicable laws and risks. Don't google "cheap cook islands trust fast instant setup i'm being sued". Plan ahead. Understand your risks. Be realistic.
Good asset protection usually doesn't rely on secrecy (see previous two points).
Pay peanuts, get monkeys.
There are times in life when monkeys are great. They can be great companions at your jungle villa in Costa Rica or fun to encounter in the wild or just walking around Gibraltar or Singapore.
What they are not good for is setting up companies, opening bank accounts, and tax planning.
Just like you don't sell your own time and skills for cheap, neither should you expect others to. Experience costs.
Don't get ripped off, though. Perform due diligence on service providers. And explain your scope to them clearly. Even a good, trustworthy lawyer can go above and beyond racking up billable hours if you don't tell them exactly what to do (ideally agree on pricing in advance).
Paralysis by analysis.
I see so many OCT users fall for this.
Are you entrepreneurs or wannapreneurs?
Asking questions, doing research, and analysing options are good things that you should be doing.
But too often I see people get stuck in hypotheticals and — by the looks of it — getting nowhere, instead worrying about to cash out their 6 trillion USD in crypto using their Cambodian passport while residing in Paraguay. In reality, the business is either non-existent or just puttering by.
Grow your business.
This is probably the most important part. If you have a business that's doing well, focus on growing it if you can continue to scale it up.
Don't take your 500,000 USD/year business offshore just to save on taxes. You probably can't save on taxes (legally) and even if you do, I'd bet the costs of doing so aren't that much different from the costs of paying tax.
Instead, grow your business. Get it big enough that going international starts making sense, factoring in all the costs and complexities thereof.
KYC: Banks are banks are banks.
View attachment 5980
— Look at all those ducks and what a nice row they form! #inspirational
This comes back to basic accounting. Companies with basic accounting don't struggle with showing invoices and agreements when banks ask.
If you want to use fiat money, you have to play by the fiat money rules. This means SOF (Source of Funds) and SOW (Source of Wealth) checks and disclosure.
Keep all statements, invoices, agreements, receipts. Maintain fresh bank statements and utility bills/proof of address. File your taxes. Keep copies of the returns. Store it all safely and redundantly.
Things are tough already and will only get tougher. Be prepared for that.
The End
looks like you summarized it quite well ..
Why is it discouraging? The information you find here is not just of one type or solely pursuing one way of doing things. No, there are hundreds of suggestions on how to run your business. Some may be borderline, others over the line, and yet others are by the book but offer additional possibilities.
What has been suggested so far are simply good facts about what is possible and what you can find here on OCT, which is filled with valuable insights that cater to EVERYONE.
Have you achieved your goal and established a company in the desired manner, or are you still in the process of setting it up? I'm very interested in hearing more if you're willing to share your experience.
BRAVO you explained it well
you archive what with this structure?
You hit the nail on the top.
You could reside in Panama for real or treat it like paper residency and stay wherever you want just making sure that you don't stay long enough somewhere else to trigger tax residency.
If you cut all your ties with your home country you don't actually need to be tax resident in Panama and spend 183 days because nobody will come after you so you only need to show up in panama once every 2 years to maintain your residency.
And that is indeed the theory. Practically you will encounter banks closing the bankaccount because you are not compliant to the requirements.
Worst case, if you come from a high tax country, your high tax home country will open an investigation and when they find that you are not substantially living anywhere, they then take it on them to tax you. Thanks to the Tax Information Exchange Agreements (TIEA's)
In your defence, it does indeed help to cut as many ties as possible. If you already have such a setup, it likely will work for a couple of years. If you now start such a setup, good luck. I foresee that it will not fly anymore.
I wish. I only get to 35 years of personal experience in the offshore industry
You can work this out. I have been a ghost for almost 5 years, kept my bank accounts in Finland, once I said goodbye the bank asked me to provide new address and tax ID - I provide both which I found somewhere undisclosed. They approved and the account is fully operating. I copied same to other countries nothing has triggered the slightest question.
Yet.
That is the word you miss.
Your bankaccount isn’t up for the mandatory check yet. From that moment on it becomes a different story.
As I said before, if you have it open now you likely will be ok for the foreseeable future. If you want to open now. Good luck. I hope it works out for you
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