Best ways to cash out crypto trading

[Ashitaka]

I have read 99% of the threads about this topic and eventhough there are some interesting theories I haven't seen many testimonials about people cashing out >$500k from crypto investing and/or trading in Europe. It seems to me that the best options for figures around $500K - $2MM are via flat rates like in Bulgaria or via foreign Corp dividends Cyprus Non-Dom i.e. Seychelles Corp.

Has anyone done something similar?

I currently live in the UK and I'm looking for alternatives since my trading is taxed as income and not capital gains, and I want to increase my volume.

Many thanks in advance for all the inputs!

 

[Jmeery1]

For executing the actual large trades, you can setup an account with an OTC broker like Kraken (EUR) or Genesis (USD).

In terms of cashing out, if you can open an account with Swissquote Switzerland (not the Swissquote UK arm), you can sell via Kraken then transfer to Swissquote and get a card that allows you to spend it (or probably transfer it to other banks if you are happy to answer questions as to source). But you may need to do some trades through Swissquote to keep them happy.

 

[Ashitaka]

For executing the actual large trades, you can setup an account with an OTC broker like Kraken (EUR) or Genesis (USD).

In terms of cashing out, if you can open an account with Swissquote Switzerland (not the Swissquote UK arm), you can sell via Kraken then transfer to Swissquote and get a card that allows you to spend it (or probably transfer it to other banks if you are happy to answer questions as to source). But you may need to do some trades through Swissquote to keep them happy.

Thanks for the input but maybe I didn't express myself properly. What I'm looking is reduce my tax rate since I'm paying +40% at the moment by either moving out of UK or changing the way I pay taxes atm.

 

[CaptK]

UAE company and residency. Crypto as a currency is illegal to use in Dubai for purchases but when you convert to fiat the law/banks have no problem accepting it.

Then you can use your Dubai company to lend your UK company funds to invest in property.

 

[KimJongsBrother]

Using SQ wouldnt that be a reportable account due to Swiss direct reporting agreement with the UK established even before CRS, remaining tax resident the situation would not change? Please correct me if I am wrong
I am not privvy to the mentor forum, but considering the values and lhe liability maybe it would be worth signing up to discuss your situation
Other that become non-resident then cash out to avoid CGT, just make sure you achieve confirmed non residency. Although if purchssed when in the Uk / in UK exchanges are they classed as UK assets?

Forget it I am blabbering, really think you should sign up for the mentor forum, I am sure you will get more insight there

 

[Ashitaka]

UAE company and residency. Crypto as a currency is illegal to use in Dubai for purchases but when you convert to fiat the law/banks have no problem accepting it.

Then you can use your Dubai company to lend your UK company funds to invest in property.

Appreciate your input but the idea is to stay in Europe that's why I mentioned Bulgaria and Cyprus.

How bad would it be to stay in the UK?

Is it possible to reduce income tax or capital gains tax with mortgage payments Robert Kiyosaki style?

From what I have read in this forum UK non-dom would only work for me if I stay passive which would be a lie so perhaps that's not an option.

 

[Ashitaka]

Using SQ wouldnt that be a reportable account due to Swiss direct reporting agreement with the UK established even before CRS, remaining tax resident the situation would not change? Please correct me if I am wrong
I am not privvy to the mentor forum, but considering the values and lhe liability maybe it would be worth signing up to discuss your situation
Other that become non-resident then cash out to avoid CGT, just make sure you achieve confirmed non residency. Although if purchssed when in the Uk / in UK exchanges are they classed as UK assets?

Forget it I am blabbering, really think you should sign up for the mentor forum, I am sure you will get more insight there

Agree with everything.

Re. The assets being bought in the UK as far as I know as long as I don't sell them being an UK tax resident it should be fine.

Re. The mentor forum I wouldn't mind if someone with experience here affirms that's true. From my understanding the mentor forum is more for grey-dark private discussions. @Admin or am I wrong? Cheers!

 

[KimJongsBrother]

Achieve non residency outside the UK, cash in then remit it. https://www.wealthadviser.co/2016/04/25/238823/art-becoming-non-resident-uk-tax-purpose

Dont know your personal situation though
How about Georgia just promoting 6 month visa and easy to open a bank account there, start cashing out draw down to your Georgia account (may be not direct as may be not crypto friendly)
https://agenda.ge/en/news/2020/2460Still sign up for mentor, I an sure the cost will pay for itself for he advice you need

 

[KimJongsBrother]

I think you.will get the advice you need there you then have options and may then make an intormed decision about the best way forward (dark or otherwise)

 

[CaptK]

Appreciate your input but the idea is to stay in Europe that's why I mentioned Bulgaria and Cyprus.

How bad would it be to stay in the UK?

Is it possible to reduce income tax or capital gains tax with mortgage payments Robert Kiyosaki style?

From what I have read in this forum UK non-dom would only work for me if I stay passive which would be a lie so perhaps that's not an option.

It will come back to bite you.
You need bullet proof and you will only get that from a tax free state with the banking infrastructure to match.

Remember tax investigations go back years so when they investigate you it's from the day you started working. The onus of proof is you ( guilty till you have proven your innocent). A massive legal and accounting bill on top of that.

 

[Fred]

UAE company and residency. Crypto as a currency is illegal to use in Dubai for purchases but when you convert to fiat the law/banks have no problem accepting it.

Then you can use your Dubai company to lend your UK company funds to invest in property.

cashout trough BitOasis?

 

[KimJongsBrother]

You need to become Non Resident UK 1 year out to establish the requirements. See the link shared earlier for the tests/criteria)
You may remit to UK once Non Residency is established. There may be Bank AML requirements to later prove income (also you prove your offshore income when non resident but good to be prepared if after yiu plan to return to uK)

If go non resident route, keep your Bank Accounts in uk, they will become part of your Offshore accounts later

Simple Cost Benefit Assessment considering your Tax Liability
- Cyprus?
- Estonia?
- Georgia?

Or Thailand..then go stay in Europe.
Thailand is a Territorial Tax Regime. In fact travel via Georgia open a Bank Account when there as Tourist.

Get a 1 year multi Entry 60 day Biz Visa (doable with agent and biz invite) Or pay for the 5 year Elite Visa its about £20k (there are other options if you google)

This will give you the opportunity to set up some offshore bank accounts using your Thai Visa and Thai Bank Account, Thai TIN number (easy to get), few really simple steps, like, Thai phone number, to build your residence can all be done in a few weeks, open other jurisdictions bank accounts (easy with your visa, thai bank statement, mail forwarding address, Thai number)
(this is possible on a tourist visa, & one for another thread depending on how it is managed, but there are risks obviously)

Cash out thru appropriate exchanges there are few in HK for high value clients. For your receiving Bank it may look better for funds coming from a HK Company rather than well used high volume Exchanges.
(admin may I post the details?)

You may find it useful to set up a Company for investment and cash out (chat to Mentor Group)

Note: although Thailand is a Territorial Tax State, DO NOT CASH OUT LARGE Amounts in Thailand they are keen on Crypto and have favourable laws but world wide tax on crypto and also cashing out more than $10K there you can get trapped on the importation of money laws. Few cases if you google, I am sure they even honey trap thru local bitcoins or craiglist. (good money making scheme for them) So keep it under $10k

The Benefit of Thailand is you may remit Fiat to Thailand Tax Free in the year after it is earned. On this basis they are not interested in offshore earnings.

Further more they are not introducing CRS for another 2 years (will still do it but probably get delayed as the elites are not happy). But as you will be non resident.UK who cares you are resident in a Territorial Tax Regime and living outside the UK

Use your cash out to invest.. in crypto

Ps: Thai Elite is 6 years if yiu go in just before the end.of year visa expiry. Use the correct website this is the government one, therr are a few agents so best to go direct
https://www.thailandelite.com/?locate=en
Sorry I was wrong on price 5 year is $15k USD and 20 year $30k USD

 

[Luganese]

From what I have read in this forum UK non-dom would only work for me if I stay passive which would be a lie so perhaps that's not an option.

Only an option if you move to UK.
How about creating a Estonia company so you can rent a nice car, office apartment, trips and food while leaving the profits untaxed?

 

[KimJongsBrother]

To be clear you are resident UK but not Dom UK

 

[Ashitaka]

To be clear you are resident UK but not Dom UK

Correct.

After a lot of research and a few consultations I think for Europe Cyprus non dom is one of the best legal options for crypto trading cash outs.

I checked UK via ltd and you end up paying around 26-28% but can only cash out around £50k/year via salary+dividends, higher than you enter in the 30-40% tax rate. Then you have UK non-dom where you basically have to either be a true passive shareholder/investor or lie to the taxman going outside of the UK for "board meetings" and "biz decisions" or appoint someone as the "active" director in a 0 tax/territorial jurisdiction.

Then I liked the Italy lump-sum 100k tax but it is not clear whether they consider crypto-trading to be foreign income.

And finally I also liked Switzerland but for individuals in Zug you end up paying 28%(federal tax, cantonal tax, mandatory social security + pension) if you leave you can claim back some of the pension money so maybe ends up being around 20%. For corporate tax, it seems to be good with rates as low as 12% but then you have 35% tax on dividends and to avoid that you would have to send that to a subsidiary in a low dividend jurisdiction and lie again with either a fake director in Switzerland or in the subsidiary..

Then, there are other options such as Estonia and Bulgaria but I prefer sunny beaches.

 

[KimJongsBrother]

Why even pay an tax ? And completely legal
Cash out anywhere then
Barbados
Completly Tax Free,2000 USD a year new program.
Dont have to.be there all the time
https://www.caymancompass.com/2020/...s,world's most beloved tourism destinations.”

 

[Ashitaka]

Why even pay an tax ? And completely legal
Cash out anywhere then
Barbados
Completly Tax Free,2000 USD a year new program.
Dont have to.be there all the time
https://www.caymancompass.com/2020/...s,world's most beloved tourism destinations.”

Yeah I read that and Bahamas and most of the Caribbean islands but the idea is to stay in Europe

 

[CaptK]

Yeah I read that and Bahamas and most of the Caribbean islands but the idea is to stay in Europe

Then you might as well stay in England and pay the tax. None if the EU options will work for you legally.

If your under 30 then a entrepreneur visa in the UAE is your best bet. If you dont want to move to save yourself the tax, then you need to set up an offshore foundation and remit the majority of your tax there and send yourself the rest and pay tax.

All European options still have tax from 10-28%

 

[JohnLocke]

Re. The mentor forum I wouldn't mind if someone with experience here affirms that's true. From my understanding the mentor forum is more for grey-dark private discussions. @Admin or am I wrong? Cheers!

Not really, there are many other reasons to join the mentor group, the major reason would be to support the forum and help us to stay around also in the future
Have a look here Advertising - Unlock the Power of OffshoreCorpTalk: Become a Member of the Mentor Group Gold for even more details.

 

[Ashitaka]

Then you might as well stay in England and pay the tax. None if the EU options will work for you legally.

If your under 30 then a entrepreneur visa in the UAE is your best bet. If you dont want to move to save yourself the tax, then you need to set up an offshore foundation and remit the majority of your tax there and send yourself the rest and pay tax.

All European options still have tax from 10-28%

Why would Cyprus not work for example? So you are saying Europe is not viable? I'm fine paying low tax that's what the whole thread is about.

Could you please expand on the foundation? I didn't understand what you said

Cheers